Hi, First post. How is the quality of Chinese dozers? From my research Shantui seems to have the biggest share of the dozer market in China. What Ive heard of them so far has been negative. I know Chinese companies have made huge inroads with other equipment like excavators/wheel loaders/graders with companies like Sany and LiuGong, they compete pretty close to the rest of the world quality wise for an unbeatable price. Why does Shantui have a bad reputation when they have such a large market share? Which Chinese companies produce well made medium to heavy dozers? thanks for the help PS this post is geared more towards developing country markets like South Africa/Brazil/India/Russia and not North America. So No need for for comments like, "Chinese commies bad!!!" and " 'Merica **** Yeah!!!" with no substance.
From an undercarriage perspective, the components are not the same between an excavator and a dozer. Dozer undercarriage experiences a lot more loads and wear from a lot more movement and work. Perhaps the devil is in the details and dozer work is where the differences show up. Of course, this technology is not impossible to master and the differences will not remain forever. Just my two cents.
That gives me a warm and fuzzy feeling on the inside
The subject of chinese quality has been discussed on here about practically every product that comes here from china. The simple fact is that chinese quality is really poor on all fronts be it toothpaste, dog food, steel, castings from foundries and everything else that can be thought of. Shantui may have a big market share in china, but what about the rest of the world? We don't know what they are here. I have been there, I have seen it with my own eyes and touched it with my own hands. I would not put South Africa and Brazil in the developing countries class either. Shantui sells machines for one reason. They are cheap. Cheap price, cheap quality, short operating life.
mate you opened a can of worms with this post and putting in the please no downing china bit good luck with that lol. but about the dozers there is a lot too it all and hounestly i think shantui is a very good dozer and they are owned by komatsu and they are bring a lot of komatsu tec with them in the last few years i know 2 americans that work for shantui in china in there R&D and marketing. Also LuiGong brought dresser so they got the tec from them also and i know Shanghai PengPu had a R&D contract with Komatsu in the 80's and in the 90's they brought a whole heap of plant stuff from Trexe and a few others.
I'd add that dealer support is very important in high production machines and you need a dealer network to support that need. If Shantui develops a dealer network in the US, I am sure they would have more success here. Whereas the excavator manufacturers have much less dealers in the USA yet their sales are fine here.
big plus is no tier anything motors that really run and don't dump all the exhaust contaminants into it's oil, among other overregulated stuff we have to put up with here.
also shantui and the other big chinese manufactures are not focusing on the NA market or nearly any developed market for that fact as the market in the developing world is so much larger and profitable.
I frequently travel to Azerbaijan and the dealer I visit there sells (already now for several years) Shantui dozers and graders and XCMG loading shovels - they have customers there who if are on a tight budget buy this chinese eqpt, yes, it does breaks down, but so does the western-made stuff (usually can't cope with the fuel) I can tell you straight that in the yard you will also see Komatsus in pieces and other western sourced machines.....so they are also not above failing (contrary to what some of you may believe). Funnily enough some of the deliveries to the yard come on chinese-made HOWO trucks working in the Middle-East bringing them from the sea-port again some owners buy western made, others go for the chinese - and as someone who travels around a lot in those parts of the world you rarely see a chinese truck stopped beside the road.
I would say china makes some of the best trucks in the world the amount of them on the road in china the amount they load onto them and they just keep pulling just says a whole lot to me i think Mack and KW might be in real trouble when they tart showing up in there market areas because i dont care what anyone says china is the trucking kings.
Ever since Volvo bought them Mack has been in trouble.
I haven't figured out why Volvo thinks they can buy a good company and totally change what's been working for years and years and made the company (as in Mack), and then run all the customers away with rebadged Volvo crap. It's not a Mack any longer, it's a Volvo with a Mack bulldog on the hood. Put the company president in the driver's seat and it'd be two a$$holes staring at each other.
it seems like the way of big business buy another company play with it **** it and then drive it into the ground lose a heap of people thier jobs then send it off shore and try and make it profitable and then when it is total screwed well then sell it to the chinese or indians . seems to be the way of the world for now anyways.
Run Forest Run!!!
??? Ok am i missing something here
Ummnh, not wanting to point the finger at any individual but it is my understanding that swearing is a no no on the forum, be it thinly disguised. And I quote from the forum rules: "No profanity or vulgar language will be permitted. Some words have been automatically censored by the message board program, any attempt to fool the censor program by misspelling or otherwise disguising words which have been censored will be considered an attempt to post the original censored word. Please use the same polite language you would in speaking with a customer."
G'day Hendrik well I am sorry but also i think they should be careful with that last part use the same language used when talking with a customer if any of my customers read this they would understand haha.
Yeah but you get the jist of what they are trying to say. This forum is not our home, we are invited guests here and no I was not specifically pointing the finger at you but at a lot of people both on this forum and other forums. It seems to be a general decay of good manners across the board. Things that where not accepted a couple of years ago seem to OK now.
Yeah manners and customs have totally gone down the drain in the last few years just look at the kids of today. P.S to the original poster sorry for the hijack
Disabled
Oooh yeah, posting off site links without warning of adult content is another boo boo.
Shantui as a brand have improved their dozers substantially over the last 5 years (bearing in mind that China has 2 markets: 1- China local market and quality is poor with little or no technology & 2- China Export market where the quality is improving and the costs are extremely competitive versus 2nd and 3rd tier manufacturers (exc Cat, Bell Komatsu etc). It is also interesting to note that Komatsu China owns 30-40% of Shantui and that there is a common "sharing" of componenets - rollers , idlers etc. In South Africa and into Africa - Shantui is developing a strong presence and the units are being accepted - mainly on cost, low technology (with a breakdown you do not want to wait for 2-6 weeks for a laptop and technician for diagnostics. There is a place for them in the market and as long as the quality continues to improve they will be bought Have a look at the latest Shantui 100t dozer - launched at China Bauma Dec 2012.
I don't think that means "#$@^**" OR &^**%$# , which are just random keyboard symbols I just pressed. What that means is things like 5h!p ( I just kind of spelled ship). If we need chiding or sensoring, please report the offending post with the tab on the bottom left of each post. Until then, allow us to have the adult conversation we wish, and allow the moderators to do their job without self appointed net cops trying to do it for them.
Look I am not going to go crying to the mods about every little thing, serious stuff yeah. They have better things to do than look at reports about minor infringements of the forum rules. Also it is my understanding that a mature adult can communicate without the need for swearing, sure sometimes it gets the message across better (sounds kinda weird calling someone an anus) but this forum has a relatively high standard (well used to have) when it comes to how people act. Far as I am concerned there is nothing polite about putting &%^&&*^ into a post, just makes the poster look like a backward caveperson who has a limited vocabulary. Although with 1200 odd posts I probably did that once or twice but then I am a backwards cave dweller who only knows half a dozen words and half of them are potty language. However if you "wish" to impose your standards on this forum I am not going to stand in your way, after all I am a guest here too and if I act outside of what the expectations of the hosts are I will be told. Anyway, technically we are hijacking this thread about Maylast and CAnT brand dirt pushers and if you really feel strongly about this, you can start a thread in the appropriate area, which I guess would be that way others can put in their 5 cents about whether ******* is acceptable but ****wit is not.
Yair . . . To get back to the original topic. I think a few people on here should take a reality check. Having worked with and for quite a few Chinese folks I can assure you they are pretty smart cookies. Chinese machinery is here, it is getting better, and if you select 'images' on Google and type in Shantui dozers and sit back and try to grasp the scope of projects they are working on and the parts warehouses and so on, you would have to be pretty thick not to realise that (for the moment) higher quality but definately overpriced "Western" machinery will increasingly find it hard to cut it in China/Asia . . . the largest market in the world. I've been keeping out of this one and just saying as I see it. Cheers
Hi all particularly Scrub Puller. You are quite close to my place in Hervey Bay. What an interesting thread to have stumbled on. I agree with all you say Scrubby. I just want to throw a couple more things into the stew. 1. The worldwide respect that Mack generated will never be lost unless people go around saying silly things about them now. If you read, you will see that if Volvo or someone else hadn't bought Mack, they would have been only history. Here in Oz any way, Mack and Volvo are very different but very proud brands and both going gangbusters. Sure, we know they come out of the same factory. 2. "Wildwest". I saw a thread here a few months ago started by someone who was openly a Chinese Company Representative, obviously trying to stimulate discussion about Chinese equipment. He didn't get much of a hearing. Please tell us that you are not playing the same game, but a bit smarter by having Canada as your base. Either way, you certainly got some people going here. I will find the thread if anyone wants me to. 3. My take on the situation (regardless of the quality/reliability/improvement) is that it is wrong to buy stuff because of the price when you know that the workers involved are poorly paid and have bad conditions. I know they think its great for themselves but ........... I've spent hundreds of hours in a "Wombat" loader and still don't know if the plastic/rubber smell in the cab is bad for my health. Our Government checking systems are not good enough to monitor everything, hence the trouble a few months back when it was found that "Great Wall" brand utes had asbestos gaskets in them. (Back me up please Scrub Puller). Having said all that, I have to confess that I have bought 6 "Haulmax" steer tyres for my truck. You bet; for the price and made in China. Best steer tyre I ever had in 20yrs of buyin 'em. But a lot of well known brands are made in China now too. (Sigh) I know it's progress, but you don't have to like it. Cheers. M
Stondad Mate about workers condition's and things in china , if you are operating a Wombat loader well actually it is a Racoon that actually now belongs to Bobcat anyways. and just so you know most workers in this feild are on from 800-1500AUD a month now who work in factory's putting machines together. Also workers have a very good standard of working condition's if you ask me most of the company's that are worth while buying from treat there workers well and give them proper PPE and other equipment. and i will fight anyone who says other wise i live in china i have a factory here putting machines together also.
will be intersting to see what happens now with the Dressta [ex IH] dozer line now that Liugong have bought them
JGS Thanks for setting me straight Mate. The Wombat came new from a dealer on the Gold Coast. I will have to wait until I see it next to tell you who and the model but it is about a Cat 950 size and looks very similar to some on your website, right down to the patch of body filler on the cheek of the bucket in one of your pics. Please tell me the quickest way to leave my $AU1500 a week job to go to China and work for you for 800 a month. We have seen it all before with Japan, Taiwan, Mexico, Brazil, Korea, Czechoslovakia and even the good old Belarus tractors and Niva 4WD's from Soviet Russia. This time it's on a bigger scale. You can't blame people and companies for trying to cash in where there is money to be made, but, in my opinion it is not right if things are not relative eg wages and conditions, safety, product quality, business ethics, social and humanitarian standards, taxation, manipulation of exchange rates, and environmental standards to mention a few. Hope you don't get your fingers burnt there, my friend.
Mate are you talking about a wheel loader or a Skid steer? as far as i knew wombat was only bring out mini wheel loaders and skid steers. not wheel loaders . i know WCM in perth are there importers for Wombat. the bigger yellow loaders on my website on the front page are 966 and 962 size loaders. Also just wondering have you ever been to china??
Men - Shantui dozers are crap. Cheap crap, with cheap selling prices, no resale value, and inadequate QC. Greg nailed it in post #4. Many Chinese products are slowly improving, but there's one item where you cannot beat quality material input, quality in design, quality in construction, and quality in parts and service backup - and that's with a crawler tractor. Caterpillar have done it right for nearly 87 yrs, and still lead the world, when it comes to crawler tractors. Yes, Cats break down, too - but the difference is, that Cat has led the world for that 87 yrs in QC, in parts and service backup - and they have a dealer with all you need, in nearly every city worth mentioning, where there's any population of Cats. If I bought a Shantui tomorrow and started off afresh being an earthmoving contractor, I'm faced with major problems before I even get off the ground. I'd go to a major client asking to tender on their work, and the client asks what I've got (most major clients today want you to list all your equipment - the brand, it's age and hrs on the clock, and condition). If I say "Shantui", I get - "You've got a WHAT?". Then comes the uneasy looks from the client. They don't want something on their job that might not perform. They want a known brand, a known dozer size, a known performance level. Then I get a polite, "don't call us, we'll call you", and get shown the door. The major companies want Cat, they know Cat dozer sizes, they know Cat performs. They don't want unknowns on their sites, with dubious or unknown performance levels. The track record of Shantui performance in Australia is dismal. They have no dealer network. The few dealers they have, carry virtually no parts. The company backup is poor. Trying to get service manuals printed in excellent English is difficult. We've all seen the Chinese instruction booklets with mangled English, because the Chinese company can't find, or won't employ anyone who has a handle on writing instruction books in correct English. Shantui falls down as well in this area. Any Shantui crawlers that have been sold in Australia are virtually unsaleable, used. You buy a Cat, you KNOW you can sell it again, for good money, when you want to move it on. You buy a Shantui, you're stuck with it, once it has hours on the clock - unless you're prepared to give it away. Shantui may have a large Komatsu ownership level - but that does not transfer to a quality product from Shantui. Shantui QC is lacking. If there's ever a test for materials quality, and excellence in design, crawler tractors are the ultimate test. Crawler tractors are at the forefront of testing the break point of materials. Crawlers rip rock, push abrasive materials that destroy any steel, work in conditions that will kill anything ever made. Crawlers don't work in cotton wool conditions - they break up the earth and extract unbelievably hard and abrasive minerals from it, in conditions that are extreme - in temperatures, and in working conditions. Shantui crawler design and materials quality is still on the lower levels of the learning curve - and if you buy one, you're the test bed. Shantui don't have a mega-dollar testing and proving ground, as Cat have - you, the buyer, can be the tester. The Chinese do not grasp the principles that Cat have followed for over 87 yrs. Make the best machine, out of the best materials, with the best engineering design - and construct it with the worlds leading QC systems that eliminate product failures to barely-measureable levels. Then test that machine until it breaks, then fix the problems and try to break it again. Finally, sell that tractor to the buyer with a level of parts and service availability that guarantees that when your tractor stops, you can get it going again, very quickly. Back up that tractor with readily-available people who will assist you with problems, immediately. That is Cat, and that is why Cat rules in the crawler market. Shantui sell their crawler tractors into 3rd world markets where build quality, materials quality, parts and service backup, reliability, and "brand name" is not understood or even considered. They're cheap, and they sell into markets where people want cheap machines. Surprisingly, Shantui actually produce more crawler tractors than Cat, in total numbers produced - thus indicating that Cat are not the leading manufacturer in total production numbers. However, Cat lead where it counts - in reliability and acceptance in 1st world projects. There was mention of the new Shantui large crawler tractor, shown at Bauma in China late last year. The new Shantui SD90-5 is aimed at the D11. At 105 tonnes, boasting 950HP, and with many electronically-controlled components, it looks good. However, what was not clearly outlined at Bauma was that the SD90-5 is merely a prototype. It's not available for sale, and the tractor is going on to 2 yrs "testing and product development". It will be a long time before you see Shantui SD90-5's taking the place of D11's on major projects around the world.
Oz dozer mate one thing i just want to say is how you point out about gear being used on the major projects well i am fairly sure the massive dam projects in china and things i think you would be super hard pressed to find a CAT dozer there. and also Shantui in australia dozer not even have a Shantui Agent they are just some blokes who import them. so i dont think anyone can put them on the same level until the back up is there and as for the statement about no R&D well that is a lot of BS mate i live near there factory and testing centers. Oh yeah also one thing i have noticed is that Shantui must be the best chinese dozer as i have noticed in aus that if anyone has a chinese dozer for sale they brand it as one even though 90% of them are other brands
Yair . . . OzDozer I agree with everything you say. BUT what do you do when a station hi-track six just out of warranty goes down with with electrical problems clearing goat-fence 250 kays west of Quilpie? I don't give a dam'n how good Cat used to be they have lost the plot when it comes to building machinery you're game to take out bush . . . and its not just Cat. most of the "western" manufacturers are building machinery incapable of working in remote areas under marginal conditions. Looking at a D4 size Shantui it looked like a pretty simple unit with pretty much no electric gismos. If they can get their quality control sorted and stick to that design philosophy I would not be surprised to see the marque go from strength to strength. A friend with some knowlege of dirt has just returned from extensive (12 month backpacking) through China/Mongolia reckons he saw very few Cats and the scale of non-mining earthmoving was far beyond anything in progress in recent memory in Australia or the USA . . . for dozers Shantui was the weapon of choice as far as he could see. Not trying to start a blue, just talking as I see it. Cheers.
old analog cats with mechanical everything do not have electronic glitches like they all do now. But they lasted too long, so now they have fixed that. Old cats were the class of the industry, but they are just like everyone else now.
Scrub Puller - Yes, I'm a bit of a dinosaur, just like you! I detest machines with electronic gizmos galore - but we have to acknowledge that electronics are part and parcel in the build of every mechanised device we buy nowadays - and it's not going to reduce, it will only increase. The upside is that electronics do increase efficiency, and can do some amazing things, such as produce welders that weigh 1/5 of what they used to weigh, yet provide a better weld arc. In electric trucks, electronic controllers and microprocessors enable the use of highy efficient AC motors, whereas previously, DC motors were the only option. The part that riles me is that the manufacturers refuse to acknowledge the frailty of electronic components and the need to build them with total protection from moisture, dust and vibration. So you have a $500K machine brought to a standstill by the failure of a small electronic part, that is inadequately protected. When the designers recognise the need to provide vastly increased electronics protection, only then will we see an improvement in machine reliability. I think you'll find that Chinese operators of mining and construction projects have little say in what equipment they utilise on site. Remember, the Chinese Govt is 50% owner of every sizeable business in China - and if the business partner wanted to purchase Cat equipment, that would be seen as an "anti-Chinese" move - and the partner would find that the purchase of Cat equipment would be blocked by their Govt partner. Cheers - Ron.
the thing is Ron, as I said in my earlier post, they are selling them in a lot (if not all) the developing markets as well and you will see that the PRIVATE customers are buying them and continue to buy them, they come with a warranty and dealers provide service support and spare parts, the same as for all other brands....something you may also be surprised to learn is that this Shantui stuff is not hi-tech, the fuel systems don't fail with the poor quality diesel that we often see in these markets, unlike the western produced equipment with tier 3 that has a hard time.....just cast your eye over the number of posts on here where guys have low power on their machines.....its not only symptomatic in third world countries and the repairs are not cheap! I was in a yard in Azerbaijan the other day and the boys had pulled down a final drive on a SD32 (30 tonner) the big nut that holds the bearings in preload had come loose and damaged the threads, so their machinist built it up with weld and cut new threads on his old Soviet lathe in it and they put it back together, machine back up and working...nothing out of the ordinary I know, but they can keep them working with minimal resources and expense and thats what they like. Simplicity rules here. 'Hard conditions' doesn't necessarily mean only ripping rock, it's not everyone's definition....in these parts of the world it means something totally different, there's not a bustin' lot of rock in the deserts of the Middle East, to them the hard conditions means not servicing them or using cheap grades of oil, putting a 'muppet' behind the levers, working in 50 degs heat, then mixing parrafin with the diesel to stop it freezing during the winter.....lets not get deluded that unless the machine is ripping out granite its not working hard. End of the day every machine they sell is one less that Cat or Komatsu haven't
Richard, I was most impressed with your script, well the bit that said "I was in a yard in Azerbaijan the other day" that was a good bunch of verbs, but that "end of the day" thing is to be avoided unless you are involved with that Football thing, back on topic the China thing is on us with Shantui Sany etc as front runners there is a market developing for this equipment, its just a matter of time, I would love someone in the U.K. to start up building a track type tractor again, but I will be under the Dirt before this happens, so perhapse the Shantui bangers might be a welcome change??? they all Calve Down with something I myself get a bit sick of the parts prices asked by mainly Komatsu as it is off the Planet most often.
here's some pics from the trip
......and this is a new SD32 that was in stock.....the engine is Chinese Cummins
I am surprised that it has the Chinese Danfong Cummins in it as normaly the SD32 has the orginal Cummins engine in it must have been clients request as there is a massive price difference.
Wow, looks like a Komatsu D65 dozer No offence indented, they may be simple to fix however the repair you explained on the SD32 would never have to be carried out on a CAT or Komatsu machine as seriously doubt that it would have ever failed There is a Chinese built dozer being used by a contactor at a new mine development in WA's north looks to be about a D375 size machine.. might be a Shantui looks like a re-badged 20yr old Komatsu
Rare SS Mate i have seen that fail on both Cat's and Komatsu's Also about the dozer in WA well that could be a number of different mobs in china there is 4 that i know of that make a 375 size dozer low track.
JGS - Tell me - if the Shantui dozer product is so fantastic, why aren't there a heap of Shantui dozers at the Sino Iron, iron ore project in the Pilbara region of Western Australia? The Sino Iron project is a magnetite mining operation, owned by China's Citic-Pacific - the largest magnetite project in the world, and a Chinese showpiece - and the biggest mining project ever undertaken outside China, by the Chinese. The Sino Iron project cost is up around AU$7B. Sino have purchased Terex dump trucks and Komatsu excavators for mining - and any dozers used there, are Cat. There's not a Shantui, nor any Chinese make of dozer to be seen, onsite? Now, you'd think that a showpiece Chinese project would be utilising as much Chinese earthmoving and mining equipment as possible, to show the world how they have cutting edge technology and brands, wouldn't you? Could it be, that the Chinese reckon it's better to sell their dubious-quality earthmoving products to 3rd world countries, while they themselves, use the latest earthmoving/mining products from Western manufacturers on their own mines? Or - was it that the Shantui dozers couldn't meet the strict requirements/specifications for Australian mining projects? It's entirely likely that any Shantui dozers that Sino might have wished to use, were refused import clearance because they couldn't meet Australian emission, safety, or other mining standards requirements. This may also be the reason why Shantui have no official presence in Australia, and the few Shantui's here in Australia are just machines imported "under the radar" of the authorities, with the aim of making a quick dollar? I've had some dealings with the company who imported the Shantui's and I wouldn't trust them as far as I could kick them - and their primary aim at all times, is making a "fast buck" with no concern for their clients.
Shantui is the biggest company for dozer in china.To be honest,they can not compare with CAT or Komatsu dozer.But for the africa or other developing country, It is really a good choice for their competitive price,convenient replacement parts.All the company have the negative news,especially when they big enough.
well lookie there, someone still sells the non-electronic run forever ntc cummins. That trips my trigger. Now if they would resurrect the 3306 mechanical in a 20 tonner...
The 855 cummins in the SD32 dozer caught my eye as well oldirt,I like it :thumbsup Thanks for sharing the photos and story Richardjw~.
Modern equipment made in and for first world countries are not designed with that application in mind... It does not matter what it is they all are the same.... A new Landcruiser or Patrol or other 4WD...... All electronic.... Any new truck all electronic.. All new earthmoving equipment all electronic.... All tractors, all electronic... Most if this is for two reasons.... Fuel economy being one, the other being legal requirements to comply to Euro x emissions standards...
O&K, ohh Terex dig units, wait.. now their CAT i guess sorry mate, will have to agree to disagree there..
The SD32, ticks all my box's looks like a Komatsu, has pressed up hubs that need a bit of work on every oil change?? plus an 855 (big Cam??) plus I notice these 32's "Sweat a bit" going by the stains down the main frame, this is enough to convince me that if and when they hit our little rock, the " Firm " (me by myself) will be flat out working on something that I already know about without ever having touched 1 before,I am often told by the older mechanic's that things come back and nothings new, this time I am ready and have all the toys to fix em' Komatsu at this moment build a Bulldozer that cannot be re-built due to the cost of parts, the transmission in the latest -12 upwards tractors cost more than the tractor is worth to repair, so after about 10'000 hrs they are knackers with no one wanting them in the U.K. they are just parts tractors, the CAT High Drives can be rebuilt easily, parts are still in stock for the early CAT 60's from the 1930's (Not many) but CAT cannot be beaten on this point, but Komatsu are Pants, bring on the Shantui. p.s. Rare SS, dont think I am sucking up or owt' but I have never seen the pre-load collar(nut) come loose or fail on any tractor CAT or Komatsu, on the 155's the Dead shaft nut used to cause some trouble, it was common to see dead shaft troubles on all CAT stuff D7 and down, but the preload nut playing up???, not in my life have I seen this, I would have done well over a 100 probably 150 F/Drive repares in my time, its the common thing for me to tackle, its what I do.
OzDozer, you write better and longer than me. Scrub Puller, you are another Aussie that is on the same page. Back me up please cobbers. This thread was started by a guy with an inane question who only has a couple of posts. He hasn't made another post on the thread that he started. He is probably spending his cheque from the Chinese Ministry of Worldwide Information now. We all know which Bulldozers are (not) the best, but JGS has taken up justifying anything Chinese because he has a presence in Australia and China. Please have a look back at the previous posts to catch up on what we said so far, because this is not about the reliability of a machine, or whether you fudge the Chinese name when you try to sell it as a used machine in Aus. So, JGS, you have operations in Australia and in China. You have had a bit of a go at me but you haven't answered some of my previous questions. Here are some more:- You say you live in China. Are you an Australian with business in China? Or are you Chinese setting up in Australia? You have already told us the fantastic pay-rates that your people get in China. With PPE and all thrown in! How many people do you employ in Australia? What are their nationalities? What are they payed in Australia? If one of your workers suffered an accident at work involving a blow to the head, unconsciousness, a broken arm and internal injuries, what would be the course of events from the instant of the accident onwards:- In Australia? In China? Don't say "We have world best practice", I want you to show what you know, and what happens at the workplace and what happens to your employee. Remember, this Forum is seen around the World, except (possibly) China!
OK mate you want to start **** throwing match as that is what it seems like Ok your Answers Number 1 (Iam australian born I come from Elival station north bourke (past fords bridge) , moved to goondiwindi QLD and set up the business there) Number 2 ( I live in china I run a factory here and also a machinery Yard in australia) Number 3 ( Also all my workers in australia are australians not that it is any of your dam business as who the **** do you think you are to come on here and attack me this way?? what if CAT employed an Indian or a Chinese or an american in australia would they need to justify it too you???) Number 4 (how much do i pay my workers well its more then you thats for sure i would not ask anyone to work for me in australia on 1500AUD a week mate if you are such a know it all why not get a job in the mines and make real money???) Number 5 ( Mate as far as iam concerned i dont care if they ban me from this site for this but **** off as iam so sick you and your **** ) ( and just so you know if a worker in australia or china suffered an accident it would be handled the same way in some cases better in china then australia, and hey wanker open your eyes and have a read any non chinese company opening a factory here has to have full workers comp set up but hey you know all of this as you are a real know it all working for 1500AUD a week and hey by the sounds of things your boss is getting ripped off) Oh and by the way stondad I am sorry for what i said i just realised how old you are and what you do for a living I should have knoe better its just who you are :soapbox
Fellas, let's cool it a bit. Let's remember we're plant men, we're here to dig holes in the world, not put it right.
Ih100, thanks for expressing that thought. It's very much in line with the way we try to run the board.:notworthy In the meantime, this thread is closed for moderator review.