Hi guys im new to the forum, have been reading for a while, but never posted before. I have a D6R that the torque converter got hot on. The machine has been sitting for 2 months and the first day back to running it the T/C got hot on me - has not happened before.... Let me back up a little. First it was loosing power, when pushing heavy loads, so I changed fuel filters. Went back to work ran 30 min. same thing - loss of power- T/C hot and noticed trans fluid leaking from bellypan. Stoped running for the day. Next morning pulled the bellypan - could not find any leaks- done a stall test 3 times every time the T/C got hot and cooled normally - no leaks. Went back to work same as before 30 min of running cool and with plenty of power - Power loss first and then temp goes up on T/C with a little engine heating but not in the red - trans oil coming from belly. Let idle in neutral engine temp goes to normal in 2-5 min but T/C temp takes a lot longer to cool. mabey 20-30 min. Thanks for any help, Brian
Drive the tractor up on some timber baulks, drop the under guard then look up at the roof lining inside the cab, there is 3 plastic plugs in a line, remove the mid one and screw in a unc lift eye into it, this is for removing the torque and case, drop it down and pull out from the back, draining the oil is obviouse, the torque converter is fairly straight forward to repair, the only slightly special tool needed is a thin deep 12 point socket I think 3/8 ** (Snap on or good spec') you will soon find what for? the other 2 positions in the roof lining are N/S implement pump, O/S transmission pump, oh and check your starter motor mounting bolts as often when the converter floods oil fire's out around this point, the output shaft will need new oil rings etc, its not a bad job to do and should allow on a first atempt about 2 days, once you have done a few its a 1 day event, a steam cleaner or blow gun makes things a lot easier.
This sounds very familiar to what was discussed in this thread
If the engine coolant is heating as well as the TC temp then check the cleanliness of the radiator and the condition of the fan belts would be my first call. The TC will show the heat first but if the radiator can't get rid of the heat generated by the TC it will always be the TC that overheats first. If that the radiator/fan drive checks out then I would be looking at the TC scavenge pump (if the TC case is not kept empty then it will overheat really easy) before thinking of pulling the converter. As Tony says the converter is pretty straightforward to overhaul as regards replacing seals, which is generally all they need.
Thanks guys. I checked the radiator - clean as a pin - I usually keep it clean because I work in very dusty conditions. belts are tight too. Im leaning towards the scavenge pump. Just wandering if anyone knows of any screens in the scavenge pump line? Pulled the filter and its clean, no metal at all, just a little smut/dirt in the bottom of the canister. Thought about if it might be a valve - solinoid not working? Because it sat idle for 2 months with no prior problems and the first day back running - all of the problems started. Had a problem a while back where the priority/dump valve had a broke wire, but it took till lunch time to get the TC too hot. Dont know if this particular system has electronics associated with it? Any suggestions on how to troubleshoot the scavenge pump, and where is it located? Thanks again!
Had my D6H start leak oil .Could see any where except around where the starer bolted on.Wouldn't do it until you put a load on it. Long story short.Pulled the convertor, it was the inside bearing. Went out and took the internal seal out.
To new for me but a peek at the parts manual shows an external three section pump that appears to do it all. Doesn't have a scavange pump in the tc housing like the stuff I'm familiar with.
Thanks for all the input. Hey Old Magnet, Did your parts book happen to show screen anywhere in the scavenge pump line?
I don't think there is one but I can't really tell. Very poor parts book identification of a bunch of lines. May have to consult the service manual to get the full picture...sorry.
there's a screen where the suction hose connects to the bottom of the converter housing.
Yes, that appears to be correct. It's in the flange that connects to the bottom of the tc housing. Took me awhile to get orientated.....the screen part number is 3T-6471. Shown at item 21-22.
Hey fellas Got started working on my 6 today. Took the line off the bottom of TC only a small amout of oil came out of the housing...... until I pulled the screen out. Then 8 gallons came out - most folks say 1 or 2 is normal. I am thinking the screen was plugged but I couldnt find anything until I screened the oil out of the buckets. I found a good amount of rubber, enough to plug the screen. So I am wandering where the rubber came from. Called my cat man he said probably came from the TC. Me being green at TC mechanics pulled the TC and tore it all apart. Could not find a thing wrong and could not find any internal rubber seals or gaskets. All were made of some type of fiber. Bearings looked good too. But will replace all. So my next question is where could the rubber come from? ------Did not find much in the filter only 1 very small piece. Hose collapse? O ring? Transmission? piece of the starter? Something falling into fill tube? The only piece I could measure looked like it would be approx. 1 7/8" dia. if it were all there. It is black, and very brittle.
Hard to tell without seeing or touching the rubber but how do the hoses look ? If they are hard and old it is very likely that the inside of a hose is coming apart. There is a big suction screen for the inlet of the pump so next remove the 4 nuts (#25) and remove the cover to see how it looks. If its clean and TC looks ok it must be a hose between the pump and TC.
You've been busy.....I'd be suspect of that screen suction line. Seems I've seen more problems with hoses under suction than pressure. Hoses everwhere..........
Suction lines can disentergrate from within in all types of equipment especially if the're been run hotter than usual!My sons had a heating problem with a late model D5 cat and traced it to the brake out of adjustment!! They bought the Cat manuals and heat sensor to locate the overheating area!! Just a suggestion hope you hit the jackpot with the converter.
But the debris is in the TC housing on the TC side of the screen therefore before any suction line
My thinking is that the trash is coming from the suction hose and being circulated by the scavange pump back to the tc where it is caught in the screen. The more the screen plugs the higher the suction on the hose. At some point you can usually hear the pump scream for lack of suction. Open to other interpratations......
For that to happen it has to pass through the pump, filter, transmissioncontrol valve, then to the tc and escape out from that rather than follow the flow to the cooler....not likely. are the pieces smooth on both sides or textured on one?
OK, according to that it can't happen..........but here we are with chewed up rubber in the tc. I'm curious to know the outcome. I can see pieces passing through the pump and the valves but I'm at a loss for getting through the filter unless that's where it originated as a lost o-ring or some other foreign object. Not sure about anything getting through the torque converter clearances. Not much in the way of rubber in the tc, couple of housing 0-rings and one conventional seal outside at the yoke. Doesn't mean something couldn't have been dumped in there some how.
Most of the pieces are ground up to about the size of a BB or smaller. A few of the larger ones look like shavings - about 1" long 1/4" wide 1/16" thick. The largest one is about 1" long 3/8" wide 1/4" thick smooth one one side ruff on the other. The big piece looks like it has a radius (curve). But the direction of the curve is like a piece of a washer. I cant tell if they came from something curved of if they just ended up that way after being ground up? If that makes any sense. I am thinking like some of u guys - internal hose failure. But which hose would end up in the bottom of the TC? I'm going to the cat house tomorrow to order bearings and stuff to rebuild TC and pick up a new suction hose for the scavenge pump. i am going to see if they can give me an oil flow chart and try to figure out what direction everything flows. Thanks guys
Been watching the conversation about the rubber or whatever in the tc, could it be a hydraulic tank cover gasket?? Hard to get pieces through the filter!! Maybe the flo direction will give you a better sense of how the pieces got to the converter. I'm leaning towards a hose coming apart internally!!
A flow diagram with items identified would be a big help. I can post more diagrams but with only the part number and brief description like "hose" it's very confusing. The one diagram I did post shows four lines beside the suction line going to the tc housing. Also appears to be a large elbow connection at the opposite side of the tc housing bottom that ties in the rear flywheel housing which has the gear drives for the hydraulic pumps but the only rubber parts are the pump adapter housing o-rings.