If I can get some help with the starter wiring with what leads should be hot that would be great, I don't have any manuals yet cause I just got it... so far its been working great up until now... it don't crank over all of a sudden... I can turn key on and jump across the starter solenoid at the engine and it starts up.. Being I have no manual yet I don't know about the starter solenoid at the dashboard, this is where I want to start testing first... The solenoid under the dashboard does click with turning the key on off, there are three leads that go to it, I would think if it clicks with the key its okay, but both red wires do not get hot when turning the key... just one is hot all the time, the other red wire does not go hot at any time, it flashes the test light for a split second with turning the key but stays off with no power to it... I would think while cranking you would have both red wires hot... and this test is with the test light hooked up to the one smaller wire going to this under dash solenoid. And another thing is when the key is in on position and the cab light is on, when I turn the key the lights dim right out, I think it does that normally to conserve battery power for the starter, but years ago when I worked on cars that meant low battery... It's going to take me a while to figure this out because I have to figure out where the wires go and where they come from, and when they are hot and not... The batteries check okay and read full 12 volts, plus it did start at the starter by jumping it... thanks for any help... Joe
Have you tried repeated clicks on the solenoid to eventually turnover? I had older fords that when the solenoid was going it would just click click click and finally........vroom.
How about a neutral safety switch? I have this same thing happen to a Case backhoe of mine. When I jumped it across the starter solenoid she fired right up.
Yeah mikef87, I don't know why I forgot about the neutral safety switch all day yesterday when I was looking at it... I believe your 100% right, thats got to be the problem, I was reading a few forums and it seems common, where people would shake the shift arm to get it to start...
Good idea humboldt.... I even tried tapping on the starter in case it was stuck on a dead spot...
I'm guessing the neutral safety switch is the one thats at the end of the reverser shifting arm attached to the lever coming off the reverser? I don't see how it can work other than being a mercury type switch, like the old thermostats in the home... because it mounted on the lever and rocks back and forth with the lever when you shift it... I figured to jump the two wires by passing the switch and still no cranking, not sure if that was even the switch, anyway I believe thats the way to check it? I think this is a wire or switch problem of some type thats broken somewhere between the starter solenoid on back... I don't know where that solenoid wire stops off going back to the key........ this is not going to be fun to find, I think I'm going to try finding both ends of the starter relay wire that starts at the engine, this is clearly the circuit that has the problem... So as I follow the solenoid wire back from the engine starter I have to find out what its attached to and switches and such it picks up to find whats going on why no cranking...
I'm not too good at electrical problems, poor would be a better word. Any time I have a relay under the dash in question, I jumper the 2 large terminals together to bypass and see what happens. Anytime I have a starter that works only by applying power to the small terminal on the solenoid, I pull the starter switch out and test for power at the S terminal when the key is turned all the way. A live jumper from the battery touching the S terminal can test the path to the starter possibly including the safety switch. Also connecting it to the Bat terminal on your starter switch will see if the relay is good.Phil
I can email you diagram and wire numbers in a few... P.S. I also have this manual used for sale, if need it let me know.
Lets break this down, first the start realy is the one that has red wire 11A, BLK 350A, WHT 23, WHT 24. 24 goes to the starter directly, 23 comes from neutral start relay terminal 30. The key here is to find out if you are getting power to terminal 86 on NS relay, this wire (WHT 26) gets power from the neutral switch and then goes to fuse block wire RED 16A (16E at switch). So remove NS relay and test for 12v at the slot where terminal 86 goes into the relay slot (should be labeled 86 on block). Try and crank the engine and see if you get 12volts, this will tell you where to go next. If you have no voltage at 86 then you need to check Neutral start switch side. If do have power then you need to check terminal 87 on NS relay socket, make sure WHT 22A has power this comes right of the fuse block as well. Do those test and let me know.
Try pulling the reverser lever down about 1/2" into reverse. Our 88 310C has the same problem. I like to think of it as a anti theft system.
Thats pretty funny, you can pull out the sensor from the reverser and check to see if the spring and ball are still there.
I'm yet to read all of your posts.... but I'm a little anxious to update everyone with this long winded post with what I found before I go back and read and reply, thank you everybody... this is a huge help having found this forum... Now it's intermittently starting, it's hit or miss.... it happened only once so far, today I'll keep trying it some more to confirm it's the neutral safety switch, because this one time when I got nothing with the key and I shook the reverser lever it started... But being it did that only once its hard to say if the neutral safety switch is really the problem, it could be that or it was just a coincident because it is now starting intermittently ... so time will tell if thats the problem perhaps? But now this is where I noticed I might have more than one problem, just to make note of is the e-brake has two warning lamps telling you its on, one is a huge big red stop sign, and the other is the smaller yellow warning lamp, they come on as you work the reverser lever when the e-brake is on... I think the big red stop sign lamp is most likely used for just about everything else that has a sensor to tell you somethings wrong..... this is when I noticed while operating the hoe arm them two dash lights were on, where before when things were working great they were not on.... so this is when I noticed when they were on I shut it off and it did not crank over.... then of course moving the reverser level started up that one time..... I need to go back out there and keep using it and see if I can nail it down its the neutral safety switch... I hope all this going on with the dash lamps coming on and off is all tied into the one problem of not cranking over... When everything was working great I remember operating the hoe arm and seeing the warning light come on for the hydraulic filter... this is why I say none of the dash lamps should be on when sitting there operating the hoe arm in neutral & not in gear with e-brake up and on.... I see it comes on when I'm getting ready to drive forward... And to top it off I keep having to ask the guys that sold it to me for the service records they promised me, they keep forgetting to grab them... I believe they can tell me so much about where this machine has been worked on.... because to top everything else off the fan thats mounted up and to the right has a ground wire someone tied into the mounting screws, and there is another ground wire coming out of the interior trim that looks more like the way it was made.... and I got it with both wires were not connected, so I don't know any history on this, like if there was a short, or the reason why they took off the ground and left it off.... or if this fan thing is tied into this intermittent cranking, so I took both ground wires and touched ground and the fan worked, so the ground was not the problem, and now the fan works intermittently with the ground connected, and this whole problem started when I left the fan ground wire connected over night... but I really don't think it had anything to do with this, but the electrical circuit this is tied into does have a problem, just like the dash lights and the intermittent cranking.... thank you everybody, I guess I need to take my time and keep digging into all this and follow...
thank you, I'm going to do that tonight... I need to bring a pad and pen because I can't remember anything... thanks...
Sure that sounds great I'd appreciate the wiring diagram.... also I am interested to buy it as well... how does that work to buy off you? are you an ebayer? because I have some bids going on right now, so I need to move fast on yours before he accepts.. thanks, Joe
I can't thank you enough times.... its been 101º in the shade here in CT. so as soon as it cools down tonight I'm going out there and run the tests you showed me... if its too dark I'll be doing this tomorrow, this is great to have the proper testing for this, thanks my friend, I'll get back to you... Joe
I'll try what you say, of course I was shaking the heck out of it when I was testing it.... and if this is what it comes to I agree that would be a perfect anti theft device
I was looking at the sensor and see there is a nut at the end, is that what you mean by removing that nut and that cover will come off? because at first it looked like an adjustment of some sort, I didn't really know what is was for... thanks for the help..
yes I am a ebayer.... This is a link for the manual http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=170228021708