Have gotten into my 1978 955L and have removed the exhaust manifold. Exhaust port 2 was blown out the bottom and port 3 is in bad shape. In order to get it off I cut off all the bolt heads and nuts off with a torch. Vise grips was good enough to get the two end studs out. I'm thinking Cat used locktite during original duild up on all the center studs. I cleaned off the surfaces and sprayed P-B Buster on a few times. I'm thinking to heating them up and then try with vice-grips or small pipe wrench. Anyone have any other suggestions? Once I get the studs out the exhaust face needs some work. I'm thinking of using block of wood and some 60 grit sand paper, but with the head being cast I can shin it up but not much else. On the intake side I have used J-B Weld with good results, but don't think this would be a good idea on the exhaust Any ideas? Thanks
If your gonna sand it to try and get by, when you replace the exhaust gasket put a liberal coating of stove cement on it.,,, will help fill some of the voids and sealing. Gramps
If there's some stud hanging out then you can get a nut that will fit over the stud, and weld it on. The heat from welding seems to help, and you can use a spanner or socket on the nut. There's not much you can do head if it's still on the engine other than sanding and what Gramps said. If you have the head off there's a real agricultural solution if you dont have access to a milling machine... Find a level concrete pad, sit head down on face that needs work, tie rope from head to car, motorbike, mower whatever. tow around head (possibly with someone sitting on it so it don't tip over) Until face is like brand new. VERY agricultural, but works. Like we say in Oz, "good enough for the bush".
The mental picture is awesome, but gotta say, I like it.
Never thought of stove cement, that should be able to take the heat. I'm guessing this would be for wood stove, right? I have about two inches on each stud so welding a nut on should be easy. I like the agricultural solution but I don't think momma would and she would probably put knots on my head.
if you have a good length of stud hanging out i'd try vice grips on it first but start by giving the studs a good hit with a hammer to loosen them abit (square on BTW) and then try to undo it by loosen a fraction then tighten, then loosen abit more then tighten, if the vice grips dont grip, then try a small pipe wrench (i got a small 6" [that doesn't sound right ]snap-on one which works a treat with abit of pipe for extra force) to break the threads hopefully not the stud, and always try and grip the stud as close to the head as possible If they feel like there going to break then get some heat onto them with the oxy, low flame heat the stud up to a cherry colour and then let it cool down, repeat this 10 or so times to the stud retains abit of a glow (the aim is to get the whole length of stud heated, not just the exposed portion) then quench with some water or crc/silicon spray ect.. once the heat is taken out of the stud it should screw out easy as with vice grips I always refit the new studs with anti-seize and fit a new or faced manifold with new gaskets also covered in anti-seize seems to work a treat
Well I used all ya'lls advice and got 7 out of 8 of them out. you know there is always one that just is not going to go. They all started off as 3/8 course thread and probably grade 8 bolts. The one that didn't go had rusted away down to about 3/16. Welded a nut on it and with not much torque it twisted right off. The stud is now basically flush with the head. Tried drilling the stud with new Titanium bits and it barely did anything. Could go get some carbide bits and try drilling again but looking for some more wisdom.
Go get yourself one of these bits for your die ginder,,, they will make easy duty out of those stubborn studs. http://temp.corvetteforum.net/c4/89paulincal/carbidebit.jpg
Yair...as I mentioned on another thread yesterday...a good operator with a TIG could centre a heavy flatwasher over the stud and with a 316 filler rod will achieve full penetration and a good strong weld. Just a matter then of welding a nut to the washer, let the whole thing cool and back it out, works like magic. The intense concentrated heat of the TIG seems to be the secret. It is possible to do it with a stick on larger studs, 3/8 would be marginal. Incidently this works really well on broken rockgaurd/roller bolts...assuming you have the frames off and turned over. The heat seems to dislodge the rust on the section of bolt that protudes through the tapped block. When you put the new ones in it pays to measure and cut them off so they stay one thread inside. Cheers.
Didn't know they made those in carbide, need to see if I can find one. Thanks I found the washer thing on youtube last night. I have an AC ARC and MIG welders but not a TIG. To add more issue to it I have never been great at welding but at least I'm better with the MIG. I'll try the washer tihng today and hope I get lucky. Thanks to all, and happy new year... I hope
the carbide bit is your best bet now. the original hardware are taper lock studs that bottom out in the threads which are tapered at the bottom in the head. use a bottoming tap to make them standard. get the new hardware and studs from Cat, they are a stainless alloy above grade 8. that vintage of machine is going to show stamped steel gaskets, use 2 of a 9Y1979. they are a graphite type that will help with any surface issues. assuming the manifold is reasonably straight, use a welders needle scaler to knock the crud off the surface, the added texture seems to help hold the gaskets in. this works for me anyways.
There is good and bad news, Good news, I got the stud out using the washer and a nut on top. I turned the voltage (heat) down and and wire feed. It managed to give me enough penatration to grab. I had the voltage up thinking I need more to over come the heat sinking of the head, but guess that was wrong. As before I can weld just don't really know all I need to know. Bad news, The manifold I bought from Whayne supply (cat dealer) is not the right one. I went back in and looked up my serial number 85J05044 and it tells me the part number is 261-0902 and it's wrong. The manifold has round ports, mine are square, and the turbo flang is about 6 x 4 inch, mine is 3 1/2 x 4 inch. This is the second time I ordered the right part but it doesn't fit. I may need another CAT dealer. I ordered the 9Y1979 gaskets and as you said they are graphite. The book says it takes 4 but after getting them I returned 2 because each covers 2 ports and this is a 4 cylinder. Wonder if putting 2 of them on each would it help seal or just cause more issues. I have the surface cleaned up pretty well but there is a lot of pitting.
Yair...good one AllDodge. I have not had a lot to do with MIGs...I would have thought it pretty difficult. The beauty of a TIG is the precise control of the heat. There used to be a silicone sealant that may help in your application. Sorry I can't give you any links but it may pay to spend abit of time in Google. Cheers.
NO on two gaskets! If you feel it needs more help,use the ultra hightemp silicone rvt. spread it on real thin so it just fills in the pits and leaves a skin over the rest. let it set up alsmot completely before assembly so the gasket wont push out. the book calls for a 1P1216 manifold. The one you have is the Cat Classic part number. Classic Parts are Cats answer to the aftermarket or limited use items. So somethings maybe cosmetically different but functionally the same. So the port design wouldnt bother me if they were covered by the gasket and wont leak. Some newer 3300 engine used around port manifolds to increase exhaust gas velocity to the turbo. There may be a problem from the source if the turbo mounting area is wrong, I have run into this before with Classic items. See if they will call Technical and they will issue an inspection of parts on the shelf and see if they have a few bad ones or if its all of them. Second is to try and outside source for the manifold or order an original Cat part. I know they are more, just an option. But I have had more problems with outside aftermarket than with Classic. Hope this helps. P.S. What ever manifold you end up using= make sure the casting doesnt hit the bolts coming thru the front cover in the area behind the injection pump. If it is close grind the manifold off a bit.
To help with the rough surfaces you might try some of this stuff... http://www.amazon.com/FIRE-SEAL-2000-1400F-ALUMINUM/dp/B003MC759W http://www.google.com/webhp?sourcei....,cf.osb&fp=3a401dd6506c160d&biw=1376&bih=601 I haven't used this myself but I have used some of their other products with good results. I hope this helps. Alan
Will look into this item as well as I found permatex hi-temp 26346 metal. Will call Whayne Supply tomorrow and see what they are willing to do with the manifold. Thanks, garp for the note or may having to grind the manifold
Called on the 3rd and called them again on the 5th. Received a call back and they wanted pictures and from what I was getting they didn't know why it would not fit. Well I pretty sure anyone can see in the picture that the turbo will not fit. My old turbo gasket is sitting on top ot the port. Not to get to far off track, (sorry for the pun) but what is needed to shorten up my track spacing? The left track has a 5 inch spacing and the right has 4 1/2 inch. Book says if the track gets to 5 inches you need to get in touch with the dealer for some track work.
Call up to Milton Cat that place's parts department rocks, I am sure they will get you an answer.
By the pictureI would say it has a 3306 turbo mount on a manifold for a 3304. If by spacing you mean the distance from track pin to pin centerline, you are in need of a pin/bushing turn. Most dealers will come out and measure all the undercarriage components for free.
The maintenance manual says " do not attempt the adjust track when stop on the adjusting rod is with in 5.1 inches of the stop on roller frame". So I'm thinking the left track is at its limit and the right track has a 1/2 left.
Id say that cat has a bunch of classic manifolds or at least the one you got with the wrong part numbers the one you got looks like its for a earlier serial number 85j they had a coupling between the manifold and turbo the base of coupling was bigger and took a bigger gasket just like the one you show in your picture have your dealer call cat techincal they will check the parts stock to blueprints hopefully you got the only wrong one and they will just order you another. here a picture of what older manifold setup look like im sure its what is going on
PAcattech you're probably right, but currently I'm just waiting to hear from them so I can put the loader back together. Had some nice weather for the past couple of weeks and my guess is I'll hear back when its cold as "you know what". Thanks Now if I can just fingure out what's goning on with my track adjusters.
Well, it turned cold so I guess that means your parts are in. The measurement (5.1") means that the adjusters are at or close to their limits. Pins and bushings, sprockets, front idlers, or any combination will make the adjustment go long. That being said, I don't know how much of a safety margin is built into that number. At some point I guess the grease piston will start leaking or maybe push out. I'm also curious to know what will happen as my 955 is around 4.5" as well.
I talked to Whayne Supply (Dealer), they said that once goes out that far there are two fixes. One is replace the track, or remove a link of track and re-connect. What is happening is the track links are stretching. When the links stretch they start wearing the sprocket. The usual process to get maximum use from the track is; half way through the life of the track the pins will get flat on the inside. When the pins have a flat spot they turn the pins 180 degrees and go again. When the adjustment reaches the end, a link is removed and the process start again. Once the adjustment has been reached again it’s time to replace the track, sprocket and maybe some rollers. The sprocket wear comes from the elongated links causing the pins to rub against the sprocket because they are a little to long. I got the manifold back today and plan to try and install it this weekend.
Well it was to cold last weekend and not going to be able to get to it this one, but I have another question: I need to remove a link from the track and I have not been able to see any difference in the links. Does my 955 have a master link or can it be broken anywhere? Also any suggestions on how to remove and shorten up would be great.
Yes Alldodge,,, look closely and the end of your pins,,, you will see one with a dimple(countersunk) in the end of the pin,,,, that would be your master pin. As far as removing a link, I have never done that. Its my train of thought that when your rails are worn to the point of link removal the undercarriage needs replacement but to each his own.... GRAMPS.
Thanks Gramps, but I remember seeing the part about the dumple in another thread and looked for it. Everyone of pins on both sides of my tracks all have a dimple on the end. Also the CAT dealer said that it is normal practice to remove a link once the track has reached the end of its adjustment the first time. This is usually after the pins have been turned 180 degrees the first time. They actually recommend replacing the tracks but hardley noone does that on the first time.
I could be wrong but your machine may be new enough to have the type of rails that seperate by taking the pad bolts out. You should see sort of an alligator teeth junction where the links connect together. Do you have sealed and lubricated tracks? My 955L has this arrangement.
They may be what you mentioned as sealed and lubricated. I looked online and it appears that the pad bolts may hold them together. My serial number is 85J05044 and the illustrations appears to be something like that.
Yes if every link has a dimple then you have the SALT rails which are then put together with pad bolts and a zipper link...... when you get to the point of removing a link, you are putting undo stress on your final drive's... I personally wouldn't risk it, but as I stated earlier to each his own.... GRAMPS.