Both my excavator’s are zero turn and not best balance when not working over the blade. That’s just a zero turn’s nature Has anyone installed additional counter weight? Did it help much? Thanks
Some offer additional counter weight. What brand is it.
Yanmar 55-5
I have the U25 which is half the weight of yours. I got to the point of melting the lead to make a additional weight but stopped at the last minute. I was fixated for a while on lifting performance but now i think digging performance is more important. I figured on a little machine like mine I prob gained 200-300kg downward pressure when digging being boom heavy. I think my machine turns easier also being heavy on one track. Its annoying at times but it has its good points also so i just left it. Quite a number of machines offer additional counter weights but i get the impression the intent is to assist when someone has a heavy attachment not so much to boost the machines performance. Interested to hear from any one who has done it to small machine.
Earlier Volvo ECRs (58 and 88) came with a standard weighted tail and an optional counterweight. Later Plus and lettered models had the counterweight standard.
My Bobcat E42, although not a zero tail-spin is equipped with additional counterweight. Actually, it was part of the extendable arm option. As 007 commented above, probably more to offset extra weight of attachment ( In my case the extendable arm) than to increase lifting capacity. Going by Bobcat specs, it looks like mine has about 500 lbs less lifting capacity than the standard arm (without addl c/w) and about 200 lbs less than the long arm (not sure if that option has the addl c/w standard). I’ll take the reduced capacity for the convenience of the extendable arm...great option.
Just thinking out loud. Do your lifting & Heavy work over your blade
Looking at Yanmar's website (which sucks) it doesn't mention an extra counterweight option that I can find. It does look like you could fab your own and make it look good by getting longer bolts that hold on the factory counterweight kit. I bet you could hang 300 pounds off the back. You would not be zero swing but minimal swing most likely.
Been thinking about trying to add some extra weight on the new case CX60C we just got... with the cleanout bucket(42" in think... maybe 48) you can't fill it more than half way or it'll tip you trying to load a dump if the dump tires aren't within 2 feet of the tracks loading sandy loam.
I had the additional counter weight installed on my 435 ZHS Bobcat to make it handle the 36" bucket better. I think it helped and would do it again of I had that option on a zero tail machine. I can still get it to tip if extended out with full 36" bucket (over the side) and I still try to work over the blade whenever possible. I always dig with the blade down regardless (for stability) as this is just the nature of the beast with zero tail minis (IMO).
It’s a trade off for the zero turn for sure
Hey Ronsii, not to highjack the thread, but wondering what your first impression is of that machine. I'm shopping hard for a 6 ton machine. My local dealer doesn't even have one yet. Wondering if it's worth the wait. Thx.
Only used it on a few jobs so far... probably less than 8 hours. The cab is not too bad I find the hydraulics very jerky compared to our 07' cx36b, the salesrep said it's probably due to the high horsepower it has.... this one also has a hydraulic pin grabber so pretty nice not having to grab a wrench to switch buckets I'll put up more thoughts later as I get more time in it.
@ CanuckDigger: Oh, one thing I remember I found bothersome is the (boom-swing)rocker-pedal on the floor to the left of the travel pedals... like most travel pedals the bottom half can flip up-n-over to get it a little out of the way, but if you do this then the pedal sticks up above the foot rest to it's left and both myself and others have had the boom start swinging due to foot slippage at times when it could have seriously damaged or injured anything along side of the bucket!!! and at high idle this thing pivots fast. So we are tying to thinkup/design some sort of sliding/flip cover that will be easy to use with feet for a safety cover, our earlier case mini has the boom pivot switch on the left stick and although you can't use it at the same time as swinging the house it is a definitely a safer system.
I am also watching to get your thoughts on that machine as well. It looks pretty good. Wish it was turbo charged.
I'm sorry but I call BULL SH!TI on this one. I just can't see how this will have any effect on how jerky a machine is. In fact, I find statements like this (from salesman) an insult to my intelligence (and what prompted me to reply in the first place). Why can't they (salesmen) just say that they don't know why instead of trying to (either) placate us, or sound like they are knowledgeable when they are clearly not. I agree that pin grabbers are AWESOME! I am looking forward to the day that I get a Rototilt or an Engcon coupler. Then I wouldn't even have to get out to couple up the hydros (saves time too!). This would be particularly helpful when going back and forth between bucket and ho-pac when backfilling foundations. This is part of the reason I really have come to love the thumb wheel activation of the boom swing (like on Cat minis and, I believe, the newer Bobcats as well). Less things on the already cramped floor space, more precise metering, and can activate both boom and house swing at the same time. It seems as though you Tack guys love those grey and red minis. I doubt that Case (or is it Kobelco in "power tan") will get you to switch over.
Just saw this thread pop up and remembered I took a few pics the other day Still haven't had much time in the 60 but everytime I do get in it I manage to get it shaking at least a couple times....each time I get in. @DGODGR : This machine is actually built by Hyundai. Here is a pic of the floorboards. Here is a pic of the screen. And a final shot of an unlucky tree that was just in the wrong place....
Here's a couple of quick vids of the two trees.
I just remembered something (about my Bobcat 435) that might be happening on your new 60. My 435 has electric over hydro controls (same as your 60?). I have noticed that these controls (EH) do not always have strong enough centering springs. If one accidentally bumps them, or if it doesn't get "eased" back to center (like if you just let go of it), it will often wiggle back and forth, slightly activating the function, and making the machine wiggle. This, in turn, keeps the control lever wiggling. This can often continue, as a vicious circle, until one puts a hand on the lever to stop it. Ironically this seems to only happen to the left joy stick (crowd function). Does this sound like what you are experiencing?
You know, I'm not sure what it has... I haven't really had any extra time to even look under the hood. The main reason I mentioned it to the dealer/salesman was I wanted to know if they could reprogram it... in case it had EH controls, but I couldn't get a solid answer out of him.... It seems when I'm trying to fine grade it just gets to where you have to be very careful how you move the controls, with normal digging, loading, hogging out dirt it actually has good feel and speed to it and plenty of power I'll have to study what is going on one of these times but am usually in a hurry so don't have time to think about it and just work through it. And in the spirit of this thread not to get too far off topic While I haven't added more counterweight to the house I did add a few hundred pounds to the blade which actually helped when I have a full bucket 180 degrees from it... but not so much over the sides
Instead of sticking extra weight out the back, had you considered buying a bit of thick plate and bolting it underneath the back. Most machines have bolts underneath that could be extended. You then wouldn't destroy your zero tail swing or have to get it specially fabbed up to fit the shape of the existing counterweight. Also I've heard the jumpiness is often down to poorly set up check valves. Does your machine have them fitted? If so you may be able to bypass them to check if that is the problem. Graham
I think that this is a great idea. I'm not sure how much it weighs per square foot but some one inch plate might make a difference. One could maybe go a little thicker but even 1" plate will reduce the already small clearance between the bottom of the house and the tracks. One will really have to be careful about letting anything get on the tracks as they go under the house.
I do like the Taki mini ex. However Taki is no longer making the TB153 a 13K mini ex that I have been buying since '03. I love what I can do in that mini ex. It has a near zero tail and near zero swing, boom can come up along side the cab like a typical excavator. I cant seem to warm up to the Taki 260 which is set up like a conventional mini ex. So if I am going back to a conventional mini ex in the 13-14K weight class, I am looking at all of them. So far I really like the WN ET65, but we will see. I am rebushing my Taki right now to extend its life, but next year I will likely replace it. I was curious what the feedback was on these Hyundai machines. The 57 looks like it specs better or as good than does the 60 in a lot of areas which I thought was interesting.
@KSS :I saw the same thing spec-wise for the 57 but the boss wanted the reduced swing 60. Ran one of those 135/153??? taki's a few years ago and really liked it The only thing with putting the extra counterweight underneath is you lose some leverage so you'll need even more weight... and right now we can comfortably haul it on a goosekneck
I'm not sure if keeping the weight low will give you reduced leverage. I would think that the distance away from the center of the machine, or even more specifically, the distance away from the weight that you are trying to counter (the bucket) will make the biggest difference. If that's the case then the farther back you go the better.
Sorry, guess I didn't word that right Basically I meant it would not be back as far as something where ALL the weight is at the current counterweight distance from center.
Lots of good thoughts. Right on.!! Thank you. My dealer got couple in last week. Hoping the to go check it out next couple of days. Holy price that though...... I usually wait a couple of years to see if a machine is a "keeper" or a dud. Depreciation is expensive. We'll see
Posted this over in the excavator forum a while back. My thought in adding the additional counter weight was to make uo for the quick coupler and thumb, as well as the weight of a larger digging bucket. I really did not add enough to offset the weight of a loaded 36 in (.55 cu yd) bucket, but it handles it well at full extension over the side of the tracks. This is 340 lbs additional. Swings about an inch past the tracks now.
Nice Yeah, I'd like to do something similar to our new CX60C... but the boss probably wouldn't like me doing that to his new baby... Ours definitely needs some extra weight back there for using the cleanout bucket unless you make sure and only fill it halfway, I think an extra 500 pounds on the tail would balance ours out nicely. And now some more thoughts on how the CX60C handles after using it on a few more jobs recently is it is probably the most jerky machine for finish grading I have used in the past 10 years.... but as a general dirt moving/digging machine it does work fairly quick and nimble, when I'm working the grade rod it seems louder than comparable sized machines but could be the tone of the exhaust or something... Also I don't remember if I mentioned it before but I don't really care for the fuel filler location or design... don't the designers know what rain is....
I'm pretty sure that the case 60 is made by Hyundai for case, it wouldn't be the first time I was wrong though ....
Ronsii I was looking at the spec on your machine n they offer a 400 lb and something extra cweight for that model. Might go over a little better with the boss man!
Yeah, when I was looking through the parts diagrams I saw they showed different counterweights, the next time I get some extra time to research it I need to find out exactly which weight is installed on it... I would think since we got it with the hydraulic q/c and larger bucket they would have speced it out with a heavy weight... but what do I know
Thought I'd revisit/rehijack this thread... So the CX60 has ~500 hours on it and has been creekin and sqeeekin something awful for the last 100 or so hours... anyways finally dropped it off at the dealer and they say it has some bad rollers under it and one of the upper rollers... shoot!!! it's only got 500 hours on it!!! guess they don't build em' like they used too eh... The dealer also says now they have some sort of 'fix' for the jerkyness/jitteriness issue Few other things I noticed about it that annoy me... just trying to refuel it is bad enough how they have the fuel cap arranged and where it is located but heaven forbid if you are running it on a warm day and want to fuel it up 5 minutes after shutdown!!! so you can keep on working... Holy-Sheet it'll burn the carp out of you hands just trying to hold the filler nozzle open!!! and then.... if you don't have an auto shutoff nozzle there is no easy way to tell how full it is without taking the nozzle completely out and look down into it... I mean would it bankrupt them to put the little floating popup indicator in there like other machines have??? And... just in case anyone wonders if we put any extra weight on it yet... nope, been too busy work is just hammered right now.
Running a 30 ton National rider boom truck (with an operators cab and a seat, that rotates with the boom, I'd call it a crane but I know better....) is my day job. I saw a used one just like mine that had a counterweight on the ass end, that really caught my attention, that is rare, super rare, with boom trucks. Needing to keep it all certified and everything, I called a National dealer, and the explanation was it was for when the carrier/truck was lighter then normal, some needed it and some didn't. After some thought I got one, 1400 lbs, $3400.00 (but certified, gotta keep it legal, and it did bolt right on) and I have never looked back. Poor choice of words, I have to keep it in mind I have a little junk in the trunk now, but rarely work that close to something. The increase in stability was and is great, same load chart, no greater capacity, just increased operator comfort as now it doesn't make my spincter tighten up even at 100% and a bit beyond the chart. I have yet to re program my load computer, so mostly just run it like before, but man does it feel better. Still doesn't dig though. My U25 does pretty good stock, as is, I don't plan to mess with it even after my favorable experience with more counterweight on the boom truck, I sure like, and use, as in working in tight places, the zero swing.