Hey guys! My jcb 1400b hoe/loaders hydraulics on the boom bareley move. The bucket is a little better, but wont float. The boom cylinder I could see had a bad frothing leak, and also there must be another bad leak too, but I cant see it, but the fluid runs down out of the box frame of the arm, when I boom it up. It runs down into the bucke the other way. My question is, could these 2 bad leaks be enough to cause the hoe to barely move and the fluid leaking out of the cylinder seal to be frothy? Thanks for any help! From John in Sw Mo.
Sounds to me like the tank is empty and sucking air.
You have an unusual problem, we need a LOT more info to have any chance of guessing. Is this a new machine to you? have you had it a while and it developed over time? all of a sudden? what have you checked already, what works and what doesn't work on the hydraulics.
Another guess: Your suction side of hydraulic pump stopped up and its pulling in air from somewhere.
Sounds like a simple problem... leaks have emptied the hydraulic system and it's sucking air. Hydraulic pump needs solid flow of oil. ANY air is bad and will destroy the pump along with making the hoe operate in fits and starts .... ie jerky or slow. First step is fill the system with oil. Then fix leaks, then fix failed XXXXX and YYYY But you didn't need the forum to know that
Frothing?? Holy cow. That sounds bad. Check it for rabies.
LOL!!
Frothing? Ide be looking at drinking that!
Seems to me if you have frothing at the seals, you likely need new seals. If you have little/no movement, you likely are low on fluid. If you need to yank that cylinder out, do you have a (preferably dry) pond you can lay it into or some kind of slope? Otherwise, you will likely have to dig a hole to plant the hoe to hoist it out. I laid mine down the slope to our dry pond. Does your LOADER bucket work "fine"?? If not, I'd be checking for fluid height real quick (I'd be doing that anyway) but if your loader DOES work fine but your hoe is frothing, it might be a hoe issue (did you pay your hoe last night??)
If you have to pull your boom cylinder, here's a picture of when I had mine out to give you an idea of the angle needed to be able to extract it. The hoe doesn't need to be pointed 'down' just down at an angle. I used straps from the cylinder, going OVER the cab and attached to the loader bucket to both pull it out and to drop it back in. (did it with one arm as other arm was still in recovery from surgery)
Thanks guys! Ida replied much sooner, as I need to get this fixed, but their something wrong with the email alerts. Anyway, It was low on flud, but not out. It coulda been run all the way out too, by the other guys, as bad as its been leaking. I put more fluid in it, and xtended and retracted the boom/arm cylinders, all the way, to try in purge air out, but it was still frothy at the cylinder leak. At 1st startup, the boom wont move at all. No side to side, up, down, curl, xtend, or outriggers. But after a few minutes everything starts to move, but real slow and weak. The front bucket is better, but when it locks in float position, it doesnt goes down any further. And the xtend boom part, slides out on its own too! Thats about all I can think of, please let me know what else I can tell ya all. Thanks! Now I gotta try n get this cylinder apart and re-packed, put it back on on try to find the next leak. I got the cylinder out.
If you have a problem holding it while trying to take it apart.... you might be able to take something like your stabilizer foot off and attach to there to have a strong "vice" holding it while you crank on it. I think I used a large pipe wrench to remove/install mine. When I did the dipper cylinder, I did the final torque of the nuts while it was mounted in place (same place it was when I loosened them) Why fight it!!?
Am fixing to try what I learned in the oilfield. Pipe wrenches and cheater bars. BIG P W, and C B's! I hope I can find big enough in here. If I had some help, I could do like stated and hit handle with sledge hammer. It shouldnt be THAT tite, tho. Here goes-!
Aw! It was no big deal. I just stuck a long bar thru the eye, then used a 24" pipe wrench, ddnt even have to use a cheater. Now, Im gonna pressure wash it off, take apart outside on the grass(to let the remaining fluid out) then put on the tractor forks n lay it on the table in the shop. This is the 1st one Ive ever done, so tips are very welcome!
If you run into any problems, post a pic. If you're not absolutely sure how it goes back together, post a pic. Somebody will know. I can't help with what you'll run into.
TAKE some pictures before disassembling it. Look out for some smaller O-rings. Get the "internal" seal out of (I guess it's called the gland?) I don't recall which cylinder these came from (I have a 1550B) seems I can't put all pics on one comment....so a couple more after this. I'm thinking this is the dipper stick.
#2
#3 I used blue painters tape to protect the gaskets as I muscled them over the threads.
#4 I bought a kit and was dumbfounded that I had extra parts. Turns out they include those in case I needed them (they must fit a different situation) Point being, you might end up with an extra part so don't panic. I'm guessing with your background, you'll be fine. I'm a "pencil pusher" and if I can do it, you'd be 4 miles ahead of me!!
THANKS!, Cause thats xactly what Im fixing to do, the pix you sent help a lot! It looks xactly the same. Im fixing to pull the piston now.
I pulled it apart. It looks xactly t same as yr pix. Am trying to figure out how to post pix, cant find the right Icon? How do I go to camera n take a pix to send?
I tried n tried, I hope this works.
The seals on the other end look good! I hope the pix of it sent, the big oring seal on the other, threaded end is broke in several pieces. Thats the end its frothing/leaking from. Im gonna try to send another/more pix.
Here go, I hope
Again.
Pay attention to the orientation of the bands on this section. As I recall, I "simply" took them off and when it came time to put the replacements on, I got confused. They did NOT go on like I presumed. I do not recall if this picture is correct or the correctED picture. I "knew" they all went on "this" way.....and I was wrong. They went on a bit different so for me, that was my one area where I should have paid more attention. Also, I once BOILED the main seal to soften it....but by the time I did a couple more cylinders, I just jacked a screw driver under it and forced it over the lips to get it where it needed to be. I think I also had a "J" shaped hook that I was able to pull upward and wiggle things around. Main point being, it took a lot more abuse than I had expected (but minimize your abuse of it, you don't want to do this again too soon!!)
I don't know if it matters but I rotated the gaskets there so their seams were on opposite sides (much like you'd do a piston ring) It might be standard, might not matter. It's what I did.
I think you(all) missed the pic of the busted oring on the threaded end. The seals on the blind end "look" good, its leaking out of the the threaded end, where the oring is busted. Isnt that problem? Like I said, this is the first cylinder Ive taken apart.
Replace them all, broken or not. The piston and rod wear rings can be reused if they're not visibly worn. But all the seals and wipers get attacked by oil, heat, time, and air is worst, so replace them all unless you like doing it every couple years.
Yep (I noticed it) As Delmer says, replace them all..... "just do it". Look at it this way, for the effort of getting in there, taking it all apart.... compared to, after how many years of use, can you swear that the outer edges of these parts haven't flattened ever so slightly? How about starting to harden up? Just do it. (Though I suppose by now you either have already done it or have decided to.....therefore, I'm just beating the dead horse!)
Thanks for telling me about the big colored seals orientation. And, yea, as much problem as it is, and the age of the machine and all, I better just do all the seals. Thanks. Ive got a set piks I used for the seals on a tranny rebuild. They should be strong enough to handle these.
I suppose this is obvious but, be very careful when you put it together. If you have some heavy oil (or some grease?) to make it slippery..... I used some of that Lucas THICK stuff that you'd use during an engine rebuild. Anyway, on my flexwing mower, I did a cylinder and evidently nicked the seal during putting it back..... today, immediately after "fixing" it, I continue to have hydraulic fluid squirt out the vent. So now I have to do it again. Fortunately, this is easier to handle than what you're wrestling with so I'd rather redo my issue than redo your issue!