Got the job of training a college educated green as can be "mechanic" I'm supposed to take this kid under my wing. Not a big deal I dont entirely mind but he has no business as a heavy equipment mechanic. No mechanical aptitude well very little. School didnt teach him much, not even familiar with tier 4 components, how to change a fuel filter, 0 on hydraulics. What a mess. Trying to teach him basic systems and he comes back with one sentence. So how should I proceed? Personally I'd fire him tell him to change careers. Not having mechanical aptitude is one thing but not showing any interest in spending the time to learn is a deal breaker. I still read through material on new systems, work hard to learn new things, and push myself to a higher level. I enjoy this trade of heavy equipment theres always something to learn and keeps the brain young. All I'm getting out of this are a bunch of stories how great our educational system is. I dont have the patience for this it will take years before he is ready if he can retain anything.
You will weed him out on your own, you won't need any help. Years past I had hired a young man to help my head mechanic as he was getting older and I knew he was slowing down. The hire was about the same type of helper as you were describing. My old mechanic gave the kid an honest chance but to know avail. If the kid didn't get it my old boy would just do it himself. (If you want it done your way, then you should do it yourself in the first place) I observed this for a while, gave it a chance but finally let the young man go. It will work out, but if you do try to make it work, then treat him like your teaching your own grandson. We seem to have more patience with grandkids than we did with our own kids.
The brain dead walk among us, No aptitude for anything beyond a PC or a program set of instruction. The first thought they have is "Any Trained Monkey can do it" until they prove to themselves they are NOT that trained or even trainable monkey. Are subtle hints as to Some people should not ever be allowed to wrench on any machinery or drive machines beyond their own car where even that is disputable, some should not ever own a home or structure that needs as little as a light bulb changed as they cannot handle that. Currently a huge detractor of new hires as either parents would/not could not instruct of basic hand eye mind coordination or the person just does not have it in their genetics to do that. AFAIAC the education system is a failure as to where it was some forty to fifty years ago, pressing kids for Mental Structure alone and developing a generation that cannot fend for itself.
The biggest problem I am seeing with the latest batch of the workforce is most don't want to think. I have a 23 yr old that has been with us for 3yrs laboring, doing a basic job repeatedly. I still get asked( what should I do?) With problems he has encountered in the past. So I then, Start down the common sense trail of questions about, what did you do in the past. The internet has ruined the thought process for alot of folks. If they don't know the answer, or don't want to think about the problem, they'll just look it up on YouTube. There to scared to take a chance.Still, He shows up to work every day, and has a good attitude. If I tell him to do something he does it, but I get 10 questions before he does it. I'm trying to be optimistic here...I'm sure those before my time were saying the same thing about my generation.
Were never pressed to self thought or Self direction, see that more and more of late. Everything was handed to them or when they would steer into self thought were shut down to group think, not a good plan.
We had a few Supervisors at the Nuke that understood the main body of hands on In Plant operators were generally self directed beyond a basic instruction to "perform a Watch Station Inspection" Many New hires could find and take the parameter numbers down but would miss obvious noise changes or odors or even visually presented faults occurring, were too Focused of Task at hand as to Writing Numbers Down even INCORRECT values, that was a fault of Navy(Never Again Volunteer Yourself) training as a Nuke or Ship enlisted person. There were others that had been Navy Officers that preferred to Direct Orders instead of allowing free hand, we would then fall back to awaiting EVERY little manipulation command, IE "Open that valve" followed by one of us with "How Far?", next up they would say "Full Open" so would open it and stand there staring at them, last one I did that to stated OK, you are quite funny I understand where I noted back No you don't but you will.
I worry about this sort of thing for my 15 yo son. He's a very bright kid with mostly zero common sense and mostly zero hand-eye coordination. I'm not sure how to approach it. He's been like this all his life, even though I feel like I've given him the ability to do things and think things through (granted maybe not as much as I should have but certainly some). He's the kind that picks up a hammer and to nail a nail he'd use the side of the hammer head, not the head itself. He's getting better but it's still a bit infuriating and I get impatient. I had him sweep up sawdust in the shop a while ago with a normal broom and his first instinct was to push against the bristles like a push broom... If it's possible (or even impossible) to do some backward he'll figure out how to do it goofy. Luckily, he's a good sport. I always go back to my experience with GPS (or Google maps or whatever) in the car. I love maps and geography. I typically have a pretty good sense of direction and can figure things out, like that. However, as soon as I started using the GPS to find slightly unfamiliar location I could no longer count on my sense of direction and I was lost everywhere I went.
Well, I guess I'm going to play Devils advocate here. Even 5 years ago I would not have the patience to train anyone. As I have aged since then, I guess I'm getting softer on this type of thing. If the kid shows up for work, every day and on time and isn't on drugs, then I would give them a shot regardless of how green they may be. It would definitely require a great deal of patience for sure and I believe I could figure out pretty quick if there was any interest n learning this trade. I realize a lot of these young people didn't have much guidance growing up whether both parents were home or not. Sometimes they need that guidance to develop. If this was me in the field with a green, this is what I would do........... 1. I would assign specific tasks that are HIS job now .......for example A. I no longer operate a grease gun as long as your with me. I will show you how to load and use it, You ARE the operator. Regardless of what we are called out for as a repair, you are greasing the machine. B. I no longer clean track frames. You now have a shovel (put his name on the dam thing) and you will clean every track frame on every track machine we come across. C. This is a trash bag. You will clean up all trash inside the cab and around each machine we come across. D. I personally would make sure I had some windex and towels on my truck for him.........Your cleaning the windows too I then would tell him that this is the type of stuff you do to start in this business, you work from the bottom up. Show me you can do these simple tasks, do them properly without whining or bitching about it. Prove to me you really want to learn what it takes to be a tech. If I need your help I will ask for it......I will check your work before we leave the job. I've learned with training anyone new to any business that if you start with simple tasks that they have the ability to accomplish it builds confidence, not only for him but for you also. Until they have some confidence, they are untrainable. Not only does this technique help with confidence and task oriented completion of work, the customers greatly appreciate these types of things. Make sure your customers KNOW that your helper did those tasks for them. A few operators thanking him for this type of stuff will boost his confidence greatly and speed up the process. This will also weed out the ones that cant handle getting dirty, hot, cold, or with no drive or interest. I have often thought about what I would do when I retire eventually. I'm thinking I would be a great trainer if I can do it MY way. I may volunteer at the local Tech schools, or even teach at one! Hmmmmm I feel like I really need to pass as much of my knowledge as I can......while I still remember LOL Soo..........Am I turning into a puss or what!??
The shop I work at needs at least two more bodies. A welder and mechanic. They have had a few that looked promising but drug and alcohol problems not showing up for work and not having the skills they claimed they had they did not last long. One of the problems with the generation that should be entering the workforce is social media addiction. We have had a few hires just out of high school. They are expected to prove themselves able to think and work. They start putting freight away and cleaning the shop. If they make the grade they would start as an apprentice. The last one looked promising but he decided he would rather work at Sports-Chek. When the current workforce retires I don't know who will replace them.
Damn my wife who has never owned a set of wrenches knows more than that green horn. She is a city gal or was and as I repaired something around here I would show her what I am doing, what the part is called, why I am doing it this way, this is what it's suppose to look like when fixed, the signs of when this part has broken or is going to break soon and ways to mitigate said problem.
Beautifully said Vetech63. We have an issue with some training with new folks at my work. This is partly my fault as I'm in charge, but also partly the fault of trainers being too soft (after I've given them the authority and obliged them to be strict). What we do is extremely foreign for a factory and extremely precise and delicate. When I started, 25+ years ago my trainers were hard, and if I didn't do something exactly right I was told to do it again, until it was done properly. I didn't think the trainers were mean, especially once I understood the processes, I just learned that the job was complex. I'm trying to be both accommodating to a decreasing workforce (meaning it's hard to get people in to work at all so I have to deal with what I get) and get things done properly. I'm the kind that can tell you you're doing things wrong while still being gentle or diplomatic but not everyone is that way. It's tough.
I like working with the twenty somethings lately. The current issue is the declining population of young people who have had to do any work at all. When I was a kid and wanted extra money in the summer I was able to pick berries or peel Cascara bark. In the eighties it was said that a chemical used on berry plants could cause issues with kids so kids picking berries was outlawed. Peeling bark went away because it was a local thing and the feed stores quit taking it. Many kids worked in dairies around here but that was seen as exploitation so was also outlawed. Some kids worked around logging companies cleaning shop or washing trucks. That was seen as putting kids in danger and taking time away from school kids who should have been studying. So to make a point, kids today don't have the same starting point in life that most of us got. They have been told every move to make and every independent thought has been ruled possibly injurious to their minds and bodies. The schools are being taught by people who came through the education system and never worked a day in their lives. On top of all that, there are fewer kids today than when we grew up so fewer with the aptitude for physically doing something. The other issue is the time frame from which we are working to get things done. Cost to do something has gone up exponentially so something I can do in an hour takes a green person three. What happens then? The conversations start getting intense and the decibel levels climb. In our day it was just part of life. In this day they are being "disrespected" and their feelings are hurt. Most are taught that this is taking a psychic and emotional toll so it's best to avoid those situations and take on another way of making a living. Put simply, fewer kids, more types of jobs around to compete for those who do have the aptitude and moxy to see what needs to be done and do it, and finally the kids won't put up with the old ways of screaming and belittling when something doesn't get done as fast or as well as someone thinks. I don't see it as they have to change to fit our world anymore. What has to change is the world we currently live in.
This is an interesting point I hadn't thought of like this... I was on the tail end of having a job when I was "too young" but I also had a stepdad who ran a big park, full of random junk to take care of. I did kind of fun stuff like run a mini-golf booth (learning to be bored), to not fun stuff like cleaning up after 500 person company picnics (learning to deal with summer heat, stale garbage beer, cleaning up hot garbage baked beans and cole slaw). I worked at a small boat dock putting trolling motors and batteries on small john boats (also learning boredom and balance). I cut grass on the golf course and had the miserable job of setting cups on the greens (I was the turd that would put the holes in really tough spots, I kind of knew what I was doing but kind of didn't, it made me laugh to put the hole on top of a little hill 10 feet off the side of the green). All those things taught me, early, what a rough job was versus an easy or good job. I think everyone should do some real boring or gross stuff and wait tables sometime in their life. I will say that as I get my son to do some more work he is getting better at and more interested in manual labor. It's good for him, making him stronger, and his work ethic is getting better. Now, I just need to work on his stamina.
I have 4 boys, My 13 yr old (the oldest)has a job at a plant nursery 2 days a week. 8-10 hr days. He has also been around equipment and laboring since he was born. I literally have a picture of him in my lap on a d5 at 5 months old. All of my kids have grown up on equipment. I couldn't imagine not having that exposure. We also limit there device time to 30 minutes a day. None of them have a phone, and won't get a smart phone until there 18, and I'm not buying it.. They can curse me now and thank me later. I always try and show them that work is important, and fun. I always give them something to work for, that way they understand why they are working. It also speeds them up. Alot of these kids have never been told or shown why working is important. Some kids probably only hear that going to work sucks, and will never understand the feeling of a satisfying/fun day at work... I'm just ranting now.... I'll shut up.
Let me have him for a summer, he will be too worn out to call home to complain which won't happen till he goes in town which is when I do once a month. I will have him in shape with stamina, knowing a few things on living off the land and learn a few skills.That's what I should do, start a 18 plus year old boot camp to help teach kids and get them in shape.
Sounds like you're not giving him much of a chance. At least he asks the question instead of pretending he knows what to do, and flubbing it up. Might not be his fault he knows nothing. Perhaps the school he went to screwed him out of his money. If he senses you don't want to be bothered with him, that can make things difficult for both of you. Is he giving you additude, or refusing to do anything. How is the kid going to learn if you won't give him a chance? I learned a lot of mechanic work from my father. Not every kid has that chance. You are being given the opportunity to shape a young mind. He might not work out, or he might be a great little mechanic. My mentor on the grader couldn't even drive a farm tractor when he started years ago, and he became a well know finish grade operator. You're still getting paid the same. I'm sure they will shift him or get rid of him if your work output suffers.
I think young women have more on the ball than young men do. The male youth seem to act like they never want to do what is required to grow up.
Spud, that'd be sweet!
Cuttin edge. My big issue is quality of work like having to ask him to do things 2 or 3 times and its still not right. I'm trying a different approach but he would rather do a crap job then walk away and play on his phone. He asks questions he knows the answer too and that have been told to him multiple times like yes punch in when it's time to work kind of ****. The big thing is he cant remember anything and has no ambition to learn. Some just cant be trained hope I can turn it around.
Start him on cleanup as noted, tell him its on Him to know where to start and how clean is Clean. Try to instill some Ethic in effort, cannot do that he will have to leave.
You make me so glad that I work alone. My wife is a teacher and she knows that I could never handle her job and I'm likely not able to train a new hire either. Best thing that I could encourage is: NO phones or devices until you are off the clock - work ain't playtime or selfie time. You are being paid for your time so commit it to the job 100%. It's not about your feelings - it's about work - get the job done right or leave. Start them on menial tasks until they can get that stuff done RIGHT the first time - that should build confidence and a commitment to quality work. If you can't get it done right the first go, repeat until you are capable of proving your reputation. That reputation can not be purchased, it has to be proven and it is priceless. Work the crap out of them - keep them busy with a list. Boredom at work is not a successful day of work. Let them do the prep work for any job - cleaning the work area/machine, getting tools needed, verifying correct parts, researching books on repair technique, etc. Maybe the mechanical aptitude will get started up... When the job/time allows, let them start seeing what is happening in the repair maybe by loosening or final torquing of components. Let them do the simple stuff first until they prove their commitment to quality work. Build the complexity slowly. I'm wound too tight to be a baby sitter. Last employee that I had over 25 years ago spent over 2 days to remove/install a set of king pins on a Mack truck. We were missing a part which did not come in until Saturday AM. I got back to shop around 11-noon, proceeded to finish repair and realized my "mechanic" installed both sides incorrectly. I did complete tear down and rebuild of both sides and had truck out of the shop by 6 PM that night. I'm just better off doing it all myself. I thank my father most every day for putting me to work at 13. He was strict at work and it really payed off for me. "You're being paid to be here, you work while you are here, no matter what the job is." From cleaning public toilets to collecting/counting money - I've done most all of it. Since 13, I've always had money in my pocket, made everything legally, stayed on the right side of the law and learned to love to work relentlessly. It's still up to the individual - be a drag on society or be a contributor. My reputation with my customers speaks for itself. Best line ever in a movie: "What one man can do, so can another. You just have to put your mind to it."
Most of us had that one person who flipped a switch and everything made sense. For me, it was an ol timer running a mom n pop truck shop. I broke an exhaust stud in an MV404 in a cab over. Right up against the frame. No room for nothing and i had no idea how to proceed. I said to him, "Ed, I can't get this." He looked at me and told me, "that's ok , when are you taking your box outta here? " I asked are you firing me? He said," no, you quit." You said," you cant, i need someone who can" I explained that I had exhausted all my ideas, he said that's different. Let's go solve this together. I never forgot that. It's all in the presentation, how ya say it.
If we are going to try and figure ways to flip a switch on green new hires I have a suggestion. Can’t do it the same way that worked for me but knock him upside the head with a 4 x 4 board. It was a roadside bomb explosion that rung my bell and flipped a switch, granted I still have problems from it mentally and physically but damn I can figure some stuff out no matter what it is and gained quite a bit of knowledge. Something about few wires got cut and reconnected in different ways. Might get lucky and someone drag in a dragging brake on a trailer or semi and let’s the tire loose rocking his world or he decides to heat lug nuts up to remove them.
Could have been the forehead tap I received at three here. ‘51 Chevy tagged me as ran into the street Mom watched it happen and knew would be burying me. Obviously they did not.
Time for him to go. If you don’t have pride in your craft and do quality work you’re worthless.
Ok, you didn't mention this in your OP. Typical young lad. I really think a couple years in the military for all graduates would do some good for young people. Respect, life skills, discipline, coping skills, following instructions.
Did he pass the drug screen and physical? Do you have random testing where you are? Do you have a no phones unless for company business policy? Have you thought about adopting one?
I don’t think being a mechanic is something you’re born with. For me it’s how bad do you want it? My buddies son is 19 and likes to tell everyone he’s a great mechanic. I’ve never seen him successfully repair anything. I’ve bailed him out a few times and try to teach as I go but he’s got a lot of quit in him. He’ll tell you he got frustrated and had to walk away but never seems to walk back and finish it. He bought a 6.0 powerstroke against my advice and it promptly broke. He and his “mechanic” friends have been throwing parts at it unsuccessfully for a couple months now while he’s making payments on it. I’ll be surprised if it ever runs again. He refuses to take it to someone who knows about because he says he can fix it but it ain’t happening. On the other hand my stepdaughters boyfriend is 23 and singlehandedly maintains a fleet of trucks and equipment at a good sized lumber mill. He has no formal training but likes to tinker and learn and doesn’t give up easily. He’ll admit to using YouTube when he needs help but honestly so do I. Last winter he asked me a few questions and borrowed a couple tools and completely inframed a C15 by himself. He calls me now and again with questions but most of the time he’s on the right track and just needs a little reassurance. He’s like the son I never had!
Like Mike L said, "doesn't give up easily", is one of the keys to success in anything. Attitude is everything to achievement of goals.
Attitude goes both ways though. Young people today are not going to stand for being what they consider being abused that for us was normal working conditions.
My age group has lost the power of observation when you get to 20 with no work experience and dont have the power of observation it will take 3 plus years to train you to work The expectations for green employees anywhere are to high most of the time and life skills are barely taught at work these days I absorbed a lot of yelling coming up I also had 3 or 4 guys that never raised there voice and would correct the situation step by step whither me but I see a lot of people doing the training now that lack the experience to be fully competent on the subject and they end up ruining guys cause there is no wisdom to hand out and this just perpetuates the problem
It is easy to rag on the younger generation, but i've seen as many or more of the older generation that is just as bad. I don't understand it, at 12 I was working with my dad doing concrete for the summer, by 15 I was more capable then most 30-40 year olds he had working for him, it was pretty sad. Some of them did not like having a teenager tell them what to do but that's the drawback of being useless, then again though concrete doesn't exactly attract brilliant minds. Back then my dad was a harda$$ to work for, and many people think being the kid you got it easier, someways yes someways you got it way worse. Yelling and swearing was a daily occurrence, if you were shown something once you better figure it out. I'm not saying that's a great way to teach but I can't say I have a lot of patience to teach people, which is exactly why I don't have any employees, I can't deal with it. I have no problem showing people things and being patient, but not when I carefully show them something basic and they go and do it totally different and screw it up. Or something repetitive, one day they are told something then they need to be told everyday the same thing again and again, I lose my mind over that. I can accomplish more in a 10-12 hour day then I could in 8 hours with an employee. I also don't have to pay for **** they break for being dumb. I see it on a daily basis with my brothers guys, **** I would never put up with. Recently one was backing over the fenders on trailer loading CTL, not just a nick, but the entire fender of the 3 axle trailer was crumpled from driving that far. I would have lost my mind and fired someone for that on the spot, whereas that's pretty much a regular occurrence. I think if you got someone willing to show up, listen, and put in a real effort they are better then 95% of the workforce out there. A few months ago doing a foundation repair, I didn't want to do some hand digging so I borrowed one of my brother labourers. I was heading to the auction and left him to dig, maybe 1 yard of dirt. I come back 2 hours later and he probably didn't do 5 minutes of digging the entire time. Then starts whining when will the day be over. I get fed up and finish myself in maybe 20 minutes. I just can't deal with BS like that on a regular basis and don't know how anyone else can. As a teenager I remember a few times digging out around entire houses to replace weeping tile, 8-9 hour days of just digging. People are just so dahm lazy.
I had it better than my parents. My father never hit me, he just put his hand on his belt. Mom was a different story. When I went to school, you might get the odd hand across the backside, or yelled at for being stupid. If you lost, you got nothing, if you failed, you repeated the grade. I went home, I was less than a mile from school so I walked. We lived in town, so no animals to feed except the dog. I was the baby of 5 kids, so I got spoiled a bit, but we didn't have a lot of money so it wasn't much. I played outside, I rode my bike. We only had one tv with 3 channels, and one was french. Later on, we got cable, so saturday morning cartoons lasted till noon. I went fishing with my dad. We had a garden at my grand parents. I helped plant, and harvest. I helped cousins when it was time for haying. I helped neighbors split and pile their winter wood, often for an ice cream, or sometimes Mrs Campbell would get us fish and chips. When I was in high school I had money cause I worked. I did a year of university, but ended up in the construction industry because of a girl, and I needed money to impress. Today You have to keep yelling at your kids in private because the right person hears..... Teachers can't even raise their voice let alone call someone stupid. Everyone gets a trophy or an award. If your child fails, the teacher can suggest they repeat the grade, but as a parent you can say no, and they get shoved through. The school bus picks up kids around my mother's place now. No one gives kids any jobs around the house. Thy don't help the neighbors unless there is money involved, most have no clue about gardening. You never see kids outside, and I know parents are mostly to blame, the big killer....my 10 year old has an I phone 12. I try to limit her time on it, but I'm not always home. Every where you go, they have their face stuck in their phone. Some companies offer another 2 bucks an hour if they will leave their phone in their lunch can, and they choose the phone. Around here, it is so hard to get young labour, that you just have to take the sneaking of the phone, an keep yelling at them.
Great stuff. Boss stuck the kid with me no one else will do it. I'm doing better got him on work he can do and be proud of. Hes getting to know his place. I've been stressing to him to not get discouraged it will take time. I was hard on him in the beginning to see what he knew. Turns out he just doesnt know much. 30 more days of probation and decisions will have to be made. He surprised me yesterday so I guess theres hope. It's funny I spend hours of my own time every day to learn new things. One of the guys at work laughed at me and said he never spends time outside of work reading or trying to learn. Must be why a machine he worked on three times with the same issue finally got fixed when I worked on it. I go the extra mile because I want to learn and if something has me stumped I'll read as much as I can and research it on my own time. I see it like this if I dont know how to do something it's on me and I need to figure it out on my time. That's just me and I told this to the new guy. Hey let's face it if your going to succeed in heavy equipment you better know tier 4 and diagnostic software inside and out.
I find myself always reading up on things to try and be better at fixing stuff, although it's different because it's my own equipment so i'm not getting paid by the hour to fix it. I am far from a mechanic, and have had to look up and ask dumb questions but i've never had someone to teach me, I learned virtually all of it myself. My dad is one of those who doesn't look after stuff, maintenance is really spotty, repairs happen when something is no longer useable and generally involves fixing it good enough so it kind of works instead of properly. Where I want to look after my stuff really well and fix things properly. I won't even try any tier 4 or real electronics, that's way beyond me, luckily I don't have anything advanced. Electronics is something that I struggle with, especially relays, etc. I so rarely do it by the time I need it again years later i've forgot a lot of what I knew. I find fixing my own stuff rewarding, and also think it's invaluable to learn more about the machine and how things work.
I keep saying I'm leaving work behind when I go, but find myself planning in my head how to approach tomorrows project. Depends on how much you like your job. I have about 2 and a half, maybe 3 more months, and I'll be climbing the walls at home for the winter. They have a 60 thousand ton sea wall protection job coming up for the winter, but that's a truck driving job for me, and that's the kind of work I leave at work.
The problem with tier 4 is too many variables, problem with most shops is about the time someone starts getting the idea of what they are working on that person is handed a entirely different task. So it takes 2 to 3 times longer to get it down. Plus the many changes in the design/updates in one years time. In order to be good at trouble shooting this day and age a mechanic needs to stay in tune weekly to be proficient. IMO
Bro, this book right here will make you a god at electrical troubleshooting. This is the bundle with the Loadpro test leads which are also very useful. Electronic Specialties 181 LOADpro Dynamic Test Lead and Fundamental Electrical Troubleshooting Book,2 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B004IKO09K/ref=cm_sw_r_cp_api_glt_fabc_J0GKEDCTXV8ZKC2WWH4H
Thanks for the heads up, ordered it should be a ton of help. Sucks we get hosed so much in pricing here, $100 on amazon canada.
that sucks. It is an excellent reference and learning guide and it’s written at the high school level with good, clear explanations. It’s written by a mechanic, for mechanics, actually the author was a heavy equipment mechanic so he puts plenty of stuff relevant to our issues in. His tool (the loadpro leads) also works on 24V systems.
That's great, I find some times explanations are hard to understand for electrical if you're not super familiar with it, so it being easy to understand is huge. I have two electrical problems right now I could already use it for. Finally renting a shop next month so I need to make use of it by doing all of my repairs now.
Do you have a copy ? I would like to know more about this book i am not big on ordering stuff that i dont know alot about.
Yes I do it resides in my toolbox for quick reference also. I will try to post more later about it and maybe some photos of a few pages
This book is written in fairly basic language and covers a lot of basic automotive electric trouble shooting. It goes well with their load pro meter. It was written before all the really involved computer systems . All in all it is well worth the money. Bob
Here’s a video on it from the author (he also has some videos on YouTube that are helpful) It’s a really good book, it has a ton of information on electrical theory including practical application of it and not just poorly understanding it from classroom theory, how to read schematics effectively, voltage drop testing, how different electrical components such as relays, solenoids, circuit breakers, fuses, sensors, senders, and so on work, proper repair of wiring, care and maintenance of batteries, wiring, etc, and a TON of other useful information the book thick. There are also some very useful quick reference/rule of thumb pages. it’s also well indexed in several different ways.
Looks very good i will try to order one today thanks.
I'm looking for some help to start a curriculum to help our new mechanic. He is starting to prove himself and actually learning and doing things without being asked. So I need some resources to help in educating mr green. I ordered the electrical book but it says 12 volt. Does it really work with 24 too? How about a good cummins 5.9 book and a basic hydraulics book?
Went thru the greenie crap in tbe 80's. Bossman hired everyone...knew damned well his kid and myself would weed them out. Ed
Just multiply the voltage by two, divide the amps in half and watts are watts.
yes the fundamentals of electrical troubleshooting book has a ton of info on 24V systems plus the Loadpro tool in the bundle works on 24V systems as well. They also have a 48V version available. a good cheap book on hydraulics is John Deere’s Fundamentals of Hydraulics book it’s got a lot in it.
I ordered the book and tester. On green hires i wonder if you got some books and told them they could take a test that you made up on some basic stuff that was in the book and they would get some cash for how they did on the test?
Rewards work for people and dogs.... The least time between test and getting the reward, the better. My dog wouldn't wait two weeks for a payday.
I was simply give the service manual for a 471 and told to build that engine. I was nervous as heck when it came time to fire it because of every one telling about it running away if the rack was not right.
cash was a major incentive for me to put all my efforts into dominating the program when I went to school for this. I was able to win two $500 tool grants plus the big daddy thousand dollar Mike Rowe Works tool grants.
It occured to me last night that the 2 year program greenie just finished was mostly remote because of covid. 1.5 years remote. Oh boy it all makes sense now. He learned almost nothing. My idea was school should have just been put on hold. A teacher friend said kids need structure so remote learning had to be done. I still disagree. Kids lost 1.5 years of education now they have to catch up.
Now YOU are the teacher! From what I have witnessed most schools don't educate these people very well in this field anyway. If he stays in this field he would be better served learning how the systems work and taught good troubleshooting skills. That is what the schools don't seem to be teaching. They are sending out parts changers by the truckloads. I know its a pain in the ass, Ive been there......but I hope you stick with him. He will have to decide for himself if this is a career he wants without being pushed out of it by anyone not willing to teach. Good Luck!
We had a greenie. Of course he'd tell you he's a super tech. Tuesday he tried to cut the top off a sealed empty drum with a torch. The explosion shook the ground and he nearly took his arm off. It was a tragic case of "Who you think you are" conflicting with "who you really are"
I got one last week its a good book it would be a great book for some one starting out and i am sure every one can learn something from it. I havent used the tester yet.
Was getting a Small Honda gas engine steel gas tank ready to weld, kid that was around and thought a mechanic said "Just Mig it will be fine" thought about leaving him try but chose not. Cap off, gas torch lit and braze rod in hand wafted the torch across open tank FUMP and was cooking, welded to my hearts content then blew out the flames with the O2. He watched astonished. Never asked me how I knew to do that in that way on a tank with gas in it. Grandfather showed me that.
We refer to it as "ambition outweighing ability".
Schools only program. They do not teach children how to think and reason things out. It's a big failure of our education system.
THINKING? but that's hard. It's a lot easier if you do it for me. Isn't there an app for that?
If there isn't Ide be
No analytical thinking. No more shop classes. Lots more gender pronouns. What a bunch of crap. One of the best things that I ever heard from one of my professors while in college - "We can't teach you the solution to every problem but we can teach you how to approach every problem, rationally analyze it, apply the basic math to it and come up with solutions to the problems." Another teacher at a night school machine shop class: "For those of you who do go on to become engineers, never forget the guys running the tools in the machine shop. You will NEVER be as smart or as talented in design as the tradesmen who try to make what you've drawn up. Ask them how they would build it - they will likely always have a better, more efficient solution than you will because it's what they do and they know their trade better than anyone else. Don't let that degree go to your head - it's just a piece of paper." I was lucky. Life has given me a great education and I'm thankful for it every day but ambition has been much more important than that degree that hangs on my office wall.
Right on treemuncher! ! Ambition outweighs ability is the problem I'm having. Still not showing any retention of what I've been teaching him. Like every moving part with a pin will likely have a grease fitting. He greased a loader greased three pins and said it was done. Without me pointing to every fitting hes like a deer in headlights
LOL Keep up the good work!
I think some fingers need to be pointed into the upper management office for some of these issues. Both dealerships I've been in hammer the techs on "Efficiency". It's efficiency above all else. A lot of techs find efficiency in leaving mess's, skipping diag and chucking parts at a problem, using one jack stand instead of two, or not replacing any of the zip ties and p clamps they removed. Sometimes they post our efficiency as a bar graph. The same graph could also be titled "easiest jobs" with me and another guy always at the bottom. In following company policy our guy simply found the most "efficient" way to get the top off a barrel. Oh, yeah, I found out that was his intent.
A family member who has a degree in psychology told me that people who are good at working with their hands are good with "spatial relationships". People who are not good with spatial relationships can be very good at with other things in life. I suspect a lot of teachers are not good with spatial relationships yet very intelligent people with the ability absorb and retain knowledge.
We have one of those guys. Lauded as a “great mechanic” yet he has tons of comebacks or if you work on a machine after him what he did is always screwed up in some way or at the least not done to proper professional standards. I personally don’t care about my efficiency rate I am concerned with doing the repair properly so I don’t have to do it twice or it causes damage. I don’t stand around talking all day or trying to hide from the bosses I just work. If they want to fire me for being slow let them I’ll work somewhere else that appreciates me in that case.
Nobody has time to do it right, but can always find time to do it twice.
Its always my way. Sort of like when I'm driving.....everyone driving slower than me is a moron....everyone driving faster is a psycho.
Anyone driving slower than me in the fast lane is a moron and anyone on my bumper in the fast lane has bigger cojones or better insurance than I do.
Speaking of driving.......my wife is the worst. She hates traffic and can become Satan when stalled in traffic. Its nothing for her to reach over from the passenger seat to lay on the horn, or give the one finger salute. She will gripe about me being too patient. Sometimes I look over at her after some simple traffic confrontation like she is a 16 year old girl. I just give her the ole eye roll and laugh.
You’re not married to my wife are you by any chance.?
So my wife has 2 other sisters I don't know about??
When given the chance to train someone, I tell them on the very first day that they need to show up tomorrow with a notebook and lots of pens... There’s just to much info to remember, ESPECIALLY if ur coming in w booze on ur breath.!!
We train a lot of people at my job and if you are brand new the things we do, for factory work, are extremely foreign to everyone. I'm a huge fan of taking notes. We have great process books that tell you how to do stuff but most people don't remember things until they take notes for themselves. As far as reaching over and honking for me, I'll have none of that!
My wife will pull up behind a semi and stay there no matter how slow that trucker moves. If I make a suggestion to go around and gain some visibility, she will ask if I want to drive. I told her one last time that I would like to finish this two hour drive today sometime and she got mad. Now I get to do all the driving. As far as taking notes goes, I remember something I put my hands on. The memory becomes set in stone if I bark some skin off while doing it.
I sure wish someone would have told me to never use your bare hand to hold a fitting flush inside a tank when tacking it in place. I'm pretty sure I know what it feels like to have a lightning bolt go through your thumb. I sure wish the guy I was working with would have told me instead of laughing his *** off and telling me after the fact. May the fleas of a thousand camels invest his armpits!