On a warmer day in December I start my Cat just to exercise the batterys, go in shop come out the whole machine and side of garage soaked with hyd. oil. So its impossible to see whats wrong so I just shut it down. Getting a little warmer now & with all the snow and rain Its all clean and dry. Sat. my kid goes for Hyd oil imagine $100 for only 10 gal. He stands watch, I start it up whoa. Ok simply a hose pinhole that goes to the boom about 5' long. I plan to go to napa and just put a coupling (its in the middle and I cant afford a new one) five minutes to get the hose off. Now my question is, why is there pressure in this hose when im not touching the controls. I havent traced what hose goes to (boom dip or bucket) there should be anything going on this is a 215 DLC. thanks sam
Most hydraulic circuits have a low residual pressure from the control valve when the engine is running. The circuit relief valves function as anti cavition reliefs while the engine is running using back-pressure in the tank cavity of the valve. With a hole in the hose, the relief valve merely did what it was supposed to and allowed oil out through the pinhole.....
Oh thanks alot, I was just scared that something else was wrong. This is the first hose failure on this, Im just so use to hoses on other machines that pressure is dead until a control was moved. My book on this is complicated reading way over my head. thanks
Before you remove a hose, stop the engine and remove the cap from the hyd. tank. This will stop the oil loss. If you blow a hose completely while the machine is working, the oil will flow like a fire hose until you stop the engine and open the tank cap to relieve the pressure.
My manual for my Case says to shut off engine, then turn key back to on position, move hydraulic shutoff lever to on position and move the joysticks left to right and front to back a dozen times approx. Then go to the cap and push the pressure release button to release any other pressure. It is now safe to go. At 4974 psi you can't be too careful!
"If you blow a hose completely while the machine is working, the oil will flow like a fire hose until you stop the engine" You are right about that. I've had a 1/8 inch steel line to a remote pressure gage blow (actually broke due to vibration) with 1000 psi and as you say looks like a fire hose. Before removing any line / hose etc, always operate all controls and be sure any loaders, buckets, or lifts (fork/platform lifts) are on the ground as they will become a pressure source if they are up etc, until all the fluid bleeds off. This fluid can come through your loose hose, open valve etc if that pressure isn't let off before opening circuit
My advice was specific to a 215, there is nothing electrical connected to the hyd. system, and all the controls are pilot operated and do nothing if the crankshaft isn't turning.
Just because the engine is not running doesn't mean there is no pressure in the system. There is usually tank pressure. Remove the cap to vent it. Pilot system will hold pressure due to accumulator. key on, safety lever on and move joysticks to bleed it off. Implement will move. Main hoses, these can have dangerous pressure in due to them holding the implement up. Mechanically support implement by placing it so a cylinder is not holding it or using stands.
Uhh, you sure about that on a 215?
Just saying in general about any piece of equipment. Its better to assume it has some stored pressure than to find out the hard way.
Just to clairify a little. I started this machine last Dec just to let it charge. No work just idling safety lever off, I came out of the shop and I had yellow snow all over as well as the side of the garage. Impossible to find out what happened cause it has 2 feet of yellow snow on it, so Sat getting warmer out and machine is all dry we put 10 gals in and I started it up and oil is comming from a hose going to the boom. So I need a hose no big deal. Just why Is there pressure present when nobodys touching any control. I understand the first reply I take it, the system applys pressure to lines until satisfied, then this residual valve probably neutralizes to -0- so I think Even when everything is brought to rest bucket on the ground, that these lines still are pressurized with engine off. My therory is every body sees a guy talking with boom in air engine off, now you can move the controls all you want and that will stay up in the air all week so theres pressure there, so when on the ground engine off (go home time) theres pressure still there. Make sense to any body. Im just going to cut this hose in half and male and female couple it. I cant imagine what those -0- ring ends are worth even it napas got them the hose is the size of my loader so I know they got that and the couplings. sam Ill get back get the hose made today.
Since no one has addressed it I'll stick my 2 cents in. I'm not against putting a coupler in to save some money, although my experience has been with a leak in the middle of the hose and not by the end fitting, that the hose is pretty well shot unless the hole was from wear. My only real point is that these hoses are very picky about fittings. The best would be a coupler of the same brand of the hose. In any case if the 215 is like most modern excavators it will a much heavier hose than a typical tractor hydraulic hose and ordinary fittings won't work.
am i right in saying that the machine has a quick hitch coupler for the bucket?.. is that were the leaky hose goes?
I probably have more experience with the 215s than any other hoe in my 25yr career. I own one now. If you want to stop a line from leaking on a Caterpillar 215, when all attachments are down and the engine is stopped, you must open the cap on the hydraulic tank. The hydraulic tank is pressurised to prevent cavitation. A hot machine that has been working can actually empty the oil tank (85 gallons) through a burst line if this is not done. A 215 has no accumulator in the pilot system like a more modern hoe. Moving the controls when the engine is not running does nothing. If you need to lower an attachment with the engine stopped, or want to be sure there is no pressure on a line, you must open the bleeder fittings on each line. These are located on the junction block on the boom for the stick and bucket lines, and on a fitting block on the boom cylinders themselves. Komatsu 150 is correct that the hoses on a Cat 215 are 4 or 6 wire hoses, not 2-wire like a tractor-loader, or most backhoes. Most stores won't put a coupler in the middle of an old hose, because it usually doesn't hold at these pressures. The fittings on this machine are "split-flange fittings" the original ones are "CAT" or "code 62"; you can change them to the more common "code 61" fittings by changing the half-clamps, that hold the fittings down. All of the information that has been given in this thread is correct in general, just not neccessarily specific to your machine. Of course, with any machine you must be certain everything is down, and all pressure is released from the circuit you are going to work on. These procedures are a little different on the old 2xx Cats than more modern stuff. Good luck, and take care of that old Cat and she'll run a long time. These things are way simpler than the newer ones. Mitch
thanks guys for all the help. simple thing my hose problem is its got cat ends all four are the same. this goes to the dipper nobody got cat ends one 90 and one straight. I cant imagine what cat wants . im broke (winter time) what if I mig normal fittings to the cats and put american hoses I cant junck this thing just because a hose, its perfect.
whats it mean my IMG code is off so I cant post a pic how ya turn it back on.
You can change them to code 61 fittings, just by changing the clamps at the same time. My local cat dealer is cheaper than any of the parts stores around here on 4-wire hoses, but they don't stock old Cat fittings either, they have to order them. Your best bet is probably a hydraulics shop. A #16 (1 inch) 4-wire hose like that will be close to $200 wherever you go. Code 61 fittings look just like the Cat flange fittings, but they are just a little smaller, and are used by other manufacturers. Good luck, and don't junk her, UPS her to me if you get tired of her. Mitch
Hy Mitch ya I found that out yesterday, so we cut it in half to couple it but the hose Id is swelled so we tried. Also they Napa has plenty if the ends you talk about, so as my luck goes he goes on his computor and another napa store has the two ends I need, will be done Wed morning. thanks
Usually if a hose "leaks" anywhere other than the ends, the plys are separated and any attempt for a patch is wasted time. I prefered the swagged connectors and never really trusted the "screw on" type connectors. I was lucky enough to work for a company that stocked "every possible connector" that we might need and had all the swagging presses also. Really makes it easier to do a prof. job.
Thanks everybody, I got a new one yesterday, from a friend that works large const. outfit that has all the Cat stuff. Ill put in in today.
I have a CAT 410c, the boom wont rotate laterally, left and right. if i pulll the sticks all the way out and then down some i can get the boom to move, but with no force. is this just he pressure finding it way throught the control valve and bypassing the main circuit? anyway, i just got this job and im trying to show out some and earn my place on this crew. any advice/help would be greatly appreciated