215B s/n2xc0040 3204 10x06494 Ill add this on the excavator channel as thats what this engine is in but this adapter was used in a lot if not all 32 series engines. The part# for this particular engine is 1w0942, the adapter goes in the head with orings and the injection lines hook to it. I have forgotten what its purpose in life was it seams like the valve inside of it could start restricting fuel and it could also start leaking fuel to its outer core between the orings and this was supposed to leak out of a groove in the valve cover or overfill the engine. Looked thru all my old manuals and sis but couldnt find any reference to it as far as its function and why it had to be where it could vent or leak off. I do remember always replacing when rebuilding a engine or fuel system.
Maybe post a picture of the adapter as a part number is only good to some one with parts access. Is it the small adapter that the nozzle screws onto. Simon C
I believe he is talking about a 1w0942 it's basically a connector between fuel line and injector
#9
Its a valve incase a nozzle plugs the pressure can open it and escape via the channel cut in the valve cover
Gotcha that makes sense , wonder why the other old type fuel systems didnt use this.
Lol the rest of the engine isn't worth saving but let's put some precautions in place to save the injection pump. I have always assumed that is what those were for but never was quite positive. I guess those are just supposed to take the place of a leak off/return line? Instead of returning fuel back to tank it leaks out of the valve cover instead? Is it possible to look up and see just how many 3208's were made over the years? They used to be in just about everything so I am guessing several million.
3208 & 3204
Have you tried to find a 3204 block lately they are very mich so worth saving. Im not totally sure how you came up with that. Sure in some applacations they sure didnt belong. But theyll run and put in a days work with all the rest
Not counting trucks their might be more 4s than 8s in equipment, that being said 4s were only in cats i believe, but 8s were in other manufactures pieces of equipment.
I was trying to have a little humor with the 8s because they have a bad rap but I agree with you. I worked on a White 4-210 last week that had an 8 in it and another I pulled from a white and put into a 613 scraper. Are the 04's what were in the early 953's? I don't know that I have been around a whole lot with those but they did quit making them before my time. One of my favorite tractors is powered by a 3208. I even took it to high school 3 years in a row for the FFA tractor parade. Was a 2255 Oliver that was grandpa's. I just wish my family wasn't so money hungry and sold off everything my grandparents worked their whole lives for when they passed. I have located a few of his tractors and his D4 and have since bought them back but the 2255 and the 2150 which was the last one he bought before he passed away.
8's were in everything. I have been into several of those in everything from Grove RT cranes to ag tractors to trucks. The Grove i put a starter in which was one miserable SOB but I have changed a lot of injectors in them. The worst was the LH set in a 613. The cab jack was MIA and changed them all by working through the little opening that comes from removing the RH console inside the operators station. I am sure you guys have a lot more knowledge on them than I especially since I don't know that I have ever had a set of heads or a pan off one.
943s had a 3204 na 953s had turbo 3204 some 225s had a 3208
Dont forget the d4h had a turboed one and d3 and d4 a b and c models and 931 935s
Id like to have one of the 4 wheel drive detroit olivers
The 1900's are pretty neat tractors. There are not many of them left though. They had the 4-53 but we're the worst to come with factory 4wd. The earlier 99's and 990's had the 3-71
Wow haven’t heard 3-71 for a long time I once had a discussion with a sales representative from a Detroit dealer who tried to tell me there was no such thing. Had to take him for a walk to see the upper engine on a grade all!!!
I don't know much much at all about the 2 strokes but a story that always sticks out to me was from an old wrench that has passed away now but he told me that when they started getting tired in the terex scrapers there was a cover on the side of the engine he would remove so he could pour engine oil on top of the pistons so they would have enough compression to get started. Not sure if there is much truth to it or not. He said he would do that to buy some time at the end of the season until they could be overhauled over winter. Was always an interesting story that stuck with me on the ingenuity of the old hands and the simplicity and reliability of old equipment.
Yes there was a hand hole cover you could look right in to the ports in the liner and see the piston
That Lincoln welder in my avatar has a 2-71
So was that common practice back then to keep them going a little longer? I have always heard stories of those things running away also. Did they have some sort of overly complex fuel system that was prone to hanging up?
When i worked out of the hall as an operator I was sent out for 5 months to Patton Tully Marine and everything they owned had detroits it seemed. All of the frictions on the rig barges, the boats, and yes even the 2 old lincolns had detroits. They got a brand new bucket for the PC800 on my barge and I spent days hard facing with that thing
I believe the most common reason they would run away was they would start burning engine oil. When I first started out I worked for a gas drilling company they had Detroits on most everything. Saw a lot of interesting failures ie airboxes on fire,flywheel sheared off. They had 53s 71s and 110s they also had a lot of dual engines running one output shaft
Big thing with a Detroit running away was an injector sticking which would hang the rack. That and someone screwing with the governor. The whole fuel system and governor were very simple to keep it all adjusted and rebuilt out of the back of a pickup, injectors and governor. As far as the oil run away that was usually after they were already running away and you had knocked the fuel line off to no avail. Have went thru the hand hold covers to knock the carbon buildup out of the liner windows so they could breath and pulled exhausts off "manifolds and mufflers" build a fire throw them in let cook then beat the crud out. Old Detroits would run along time after they were wore out. I remember joking a Cat man out of Peoria years ago when I had a mechanics truck that had a experimental 3116 that he would come down and run the overhead on and do all his checks on every few months that Cat had copied Detroit and just complicated the **** out of what could be done with a screwdriver, vise grips and a bungee cord.
You hit the nail on the head with a 3116. You should have gave him a swift kick in the beans!
All of the 3100 A & B cats are awful. My first dive into one was in a 2DS 963C about 2 years ago. It was running really rough and very low on power so I got out the ole sight glass and found that there was no air entering the head but a ton in the return so decided to pull injectors and have them checked. After getting them out there were cabon traces in cups 2,4 and 5 I figured the reaming and pressing would be enough to seal a new set of injectors. After buying the tool groups to press the injectors in and to adjust everything plus the reamer for the cups (I will be dead and my kids will be using those tools before they are paid for) I found out that 2 of the cups were previously reamed and had to go buy the tool group to replace the cups. So my very first time with one was the full experience. I had over 70hours in that thing which I knew was waaayyyy to much so I called the dealer and asked for a quote to do everything and they were at about a third of that with travel time. I wound up charging the customer the same hours because I never believe they should have to pay for my education and boy did I get one. My next one I did all of that to was in a 960F wheel loader and had it done in less time than dealer quoted so I felt pretty good about that. I really wish I could have gotten my education on the wheel loader though because it makes a world of difference being able to see what you are doing and be able to stand/sit comfortably while doing something as complicated as that process because working through the hole under the seat of that 963 was miserable especially since I had absolutely no idea what I was doing. My shoulders and sides were sore for a week from having to lay on your side and work through the bottom of a 5 gal bucket. I want to find the engineer that removed the tilt feature off the crawler loader cabs and kick him in the nuts so hard he can scratch his balls and pick his nose at the same time. I do feel that after doing one that I could see everything going on and having a way better grasp of how they actually function I could do a set of cups and injectors in a good long day. I spent so much time trying to get the synchronization just perfect following the tool operating manual that is not necessary and figured out a couple of little tricks to help make things easier.
Our 53c had the same trouble. I pulled them cleaned the cups cleaned the injectors fitted new oring and put 515 loctite on the little oring on the nozzle end put them in the same hole they where in turque them a few smacks with a brass drift re turqued the hold down slapped the rack back in and its dome atleast 100 hours since with out a hickup best its ran since we owned it!
I didn't think the little oring down at the bottom was supposed to be used anymore. There are so many contradictions between all of the different media #'s and updates and bulletins on those fuel systems I don't think that mother cat has any idea what is correct either.
I was a dealer tech when the 1.1 / 1.2 engine family was introduced. We were always getting updated training. Cat never could figure out a tune- up procedure. Then, we switched to the Carpenter procedure. Just trying to keep up with the Service Magazine, Truck Engine News, TIB and PSP was a job in itself. Top it off, the governor was a specialty in itself. If not already familiar, they will eat your lunch everytime.
No idea but its running fine our parts book didnt list them and the website did so i figured it was the latest and greatest
I’ve found the best way to synchronize them is while they’re running. I quit using the sync tools years ago. I do an initial set up by feel when assembling the rack and injectors. The problem is if you put in a mix of used and new injectors the delivery is different on them so doing a basic sync will leave a rough idle. This is why you have injector trim codes on electronic injectors to match the delivery.
That is an understatement. I will definitely never forget it but I feel I have a better understanding of how everything works by figuring it out on my own versus someone holding my hand the whole way through
Please explain because I have spent hours reading on these engines and have never heard of either of your methods.
You won’t find it in a book. I learned 30 plus years ago at the cat dealer how to use the tooling and after realizing the synch tools did a so so job of getting a smooth idle I came up with my own field adjustment style. I have a pry bar that I can twist in position against the end of the rack rod on each injector . One at a time I go down the line just feathering each injector to the more fuel delivery position. If the idle quality improves then I will adj that injector slightly higher by turning the screw in. After you have done a few you can get so you can hear which ones are weak and which ones are over fueling. This also works to find a dead cylinder. If you you push the injector open and nothing happens it’s a dead hole. You can do the actual adjustment with the tool without shutting the engine off but you have to have a steady hand and watch out for rocker arms moving. For initial set up I crack all the synch screw lock nuts loose and put a holder against number one in the 0 position. I then turn each screw with my finger tips until I feel and see it contact the rack control arm. This is theoretically the 0 position. I tighten the locknut at that point with the rack adjustment tool careful to hold the screw without it turning. That is good enough to start and warm up the engine then do the final trim adjustment.
Mobiltech, Great explanation. Thanks Do you 0-ring the nozzles, or not? I prefer to o-ring despite what Cat recommends. I think the o-rings work long enough for the carbon damn to form.
I understand and having never worked at a dealer and still being in grade school when these were still being produced I probably will never see them often enough to get that familiar with them. I went my first 12 years working on mainly farm equipment and having never worked on one until 2 years ago and the second one i have ever touched was back in January so I will never make it to any of you guys experience levels. I see too much different equipment being independent to be really knowledgeable on any 1 thing. Tomorrow I am heading out to replace the pump and injectors on a RGW D6T but yesterday I was welding a cracked frame on a 50' anhydrous applicator.
I would also like a straight answer on this as well. According to the press tool instructions by "coining" the injector into the cup you shouldn't need them but on that first one I guess with the awkward positions and lack of visibility I really struggled to ream the cups properly to get a couple of the injectors to seal up and had to install the o-rings.
Sorry hatch for running your post so far off topic. I probably should have just kept quiet about the other engines. We have been through the 3200 cats to detroits and now the 3100 cats. I do appreciate everyone's input though. All of this stuff is very interesting to me and with so few of these engines and the guys that maintained them left I try to soak up as much information as I can when I can
I kept a substantial 1.1/1.2 library. It’s stashed somewhere. I remember the PIP saying something like the o-ring only lasts for a few hours of operation. But, if you ream the cups perfectly, they should seal. But, that’s never the case when you are hanging upside down, trying to sneak under the firewall of a GM medium duty. The o-ring itself, changed materials and part numbers over the years. There were tons of them sold up here to gill netters, dive boats, charter boats, seine boats. I remember one particular dive boat that had triple 350hp. Hardly any room between them to work. Same boat that got raided by the Feds while I was working on it. Hey, don’t point that at me. I’m just the Cat mechanic. Something, Something about drug running and geoduck poaching.
I put the o ring in if I can get them especially if I have a seat I don’t like. As far as reaming goes I’ve seen info saying we are not supposed to do that anymore. I know you definitely don’t want to take too much. Don’t expect to completely remove the old seating mark . The only tools I use for them is the rack adj wrench and the reamer. I seat the injector with a careful tap on the hold down plate. The timing can be done with a digital calliper. I wish I had the sleeve replacement tools but at this point that kit will never pay for itself.
I know what you mean, at my age and lifestyle, I don’t even purchase green bananas.
In grade school I was in dipers the last year of production!
I hear ya. I have a litte over $10,000 in everything for just the damn unit injectors. I will be retired by the time mine are paid for and I have quite a while before that time comes
I wish I had the sleeve replacement tools but at this point that kit will never pay for itself. Mobile keep an eye out on Ebay bought the Cat removal and replacement kit their years ago, bought the setup way before that back in 93 from Cat. But I will give your way a shot next time ,I really appreciate that little nugget. 14 no problem on the hijacking Ive enjoyed the show, And Id already got an answer on the adapters at the start of it.
Just did some googling...when the first went into production I was not even thought of lol. I was 5 when they stopped I started off with this kit and a lot of the components are actual cat tooling but the expander is basically a paperweight. I really started to lose my cool when it got stuck in one of the cups so I bought the one from cat. I also don't use the forcing bridge because it is pretty chincy. I used the one from the injector seating group instead. Overall it is a fairly descent kit as long as you know ahead of time to replace a few of the prices with real cat stuff. They also have the rest of the tooling for the injectors if you want to take a chance on them https://www.freedomracing.com/143-2099-mui-r-i-3114-3116-3126-mui-injector-sleeve-remover-installer-set-alt.html Search results for: '3116' Home of the largest in-stock inventory of OEM and aftermarket Automotive Specialty Tools. Live inventory and next day delivery on thousands of items. www.freedomracing.com
Mine are cat but the cup r&r came from someone selling their cat kit on ebay
I like ebay. I buy a lot of my high dollar equipment from there. I think all of my hollow rams and 1 or 2 foot pedals came from there, my big lathe came from there. Good deals can still be found as long as you are patient. Have been watching for a couple weeks now for a good deal on a used 1½" hytorc. Between all 4 of my hollow rams I have less than $1500 invested. I buy qua