Sorry this isn’t directly heavy equipment related, I got into the IUOE apprenticeship and my then and still current employer “rehired” me off the books as they are a union contractor. My biggest question is if I wanted to go somewhere different would I be able to call the hall and have them put me back on the books? If I left and went to get hired through the hall would it get marked as me declining work?
Gonna have to call your Business Rep, different Halls, rules adjust. I was IUOE 148, we were Stationary where our Local rules were different to Moving Equipment .
Being an apprentice you need to have a good reason to leave your current employer. Like Dave said, call your business agent and explain what you want to do before doing anything else.
As Tinkerer said. If your employer is honoring the contract your B A will probably tell you to stay
Why would you like to work at a different shop? Is there something unsafe or another employee causing you trouble or you just don't like what you're told to do. The reason(s) you want to go somewhere else could make a difference on if you'll be able to just go back on the list.
Cade said in his first post that his question isn't heavy equiment related. I understand that it his emplyment situation. Local 150 that I am in represent a lot of different occpations. Surveyors are one example. Municipal emplyees is another.
I’m contracted as a heavy equipment operator, my co workers can be tough to get along with but I don’t really care I can manage it. I get used as a laborer 95% of the time which wouldn’t bother me if that’s what I signed up for. I hardly ever get to run equipment so it’s difficult to get the hours I need for the apprenticeship
I work at a family owned company in my hometown and I’ve known all my co workers since I was a kid. The only issue I have is not getting to run equipment. That sounds kinda bratty I guess it’s just what I’m contracted as. I joined the apprenticeship because running machines is a passion and I love it. I Just don’t get to do it here
You are in your test period, give up now and the work you want may never come. Have to eat a little crow and be a laborer for awhile to gain trust that you will listen and remember who is the trainer and who is being trained. Been there, done it many times, still have respect from those old hands I could stick out the test days. In Teamsters is where I experienced this first, tons of grunt cleanup, dragging heavy tools to and from tool room. Listened to the old guys, figured out what and where I needed to be when in a job with another mechanic journeyman and learned to be a step ahead, then I was taught more advanced. Learners were called Plebe, answered to it as well. At the Nuke, in my thirties, I was called Duck. Follow the leader like a duckling, remember what shown and became good enough to gain trust in judgement and work. Buying beer after end of shift bought extra knowledge.
OK, I understand where you're coming from. I have a welding background and was lucky I got to actually weld and build things as a 1st year apprentice. I worked in a tank shop and did some work on tanks and building skids but mostly built hooped safety ladders for 400bbl and larger tanks. I did it for 7 1/2 month's and the guy in the tool crib said I must dream of ladders. Kind of monotonous but a lot of 1st year apprentices get stuck on a grinder and doing grunt work and barely get to grab the stinger. I suspect it may be a similar situation with new equipment operators. I didn't work in union shops too much but have heard it's pretty much the same. You should talk to your BA and find out what exactly the job description is for a 1st year operator. I would think driving a packer or other less complicated machine might qualify. Then you could work up to driving a truck and maybe get training to run a skid steer. If the union has a laborers division and you're treated as more of a laborer than what an operator should be doing then you could have a legitimate complaint. How long have been in the union? Maybe the company is testing you, in a way, to see how dependable you are doing mundane tasks. Everybody has to start at the bottom doing the less desirable tasks.
You are in way different situation than someone that is an apprentice and was dispatched to a contractor. Not one I would want to be in. Were you employed there before you became an apprentice ? If you were, did pizz off your employer and any of those co-workers ? You may never get to run equipment much if that is environment you are in.
Never did anything that I could think would make them mad at me. The owners are basically family to me, marriage through grandparents and what not whole different story, known them forever. It’s not just me, they have more operators than laborers and they use all the younger guys as full time laborers and even some of the older guys. I‘ve been told by multiple co workers that if I want to learn to run equipment then I’m with the wrong people. And yes I have worked here since I turned 18 and I got into the apprenticeship about 6 months ago right around my 19th birthday (I know my length of time in the apprenticeship isn’t helping my case)
talk to your B A. Make sure he understands your situation. you are really kind of caught between a rock and a hard place.
I’d like to think they were just testing me to see how dependable I am but I’m all reality the only people that run the crews are the direct family members of the owners (sons and brothers). They’ll get off they’re equipment to come do something on another piece before they’ll let anyone else get on anything. They’re good people they just don’t trust anyone other than family to run their stuff
The only reason I haven’t talked about it with my boss or called anyone yet is because my boss has done a lot for me. He has a pretty big name with our local union so I’m sure his letter of recommendation did me some good on getting in, and he’s sending me off with a semi to go take my cdl test later this month. I’d feel bad leaving them a hand short I just don’t think staying there is what’s best for what I’d like to do
So if I read this right- you started working for them at 18, you're now 19. I'll just be honest- you don't know enough to be running equipment full time. Being on the end of a shovel or a grade rod is the best learning you can get. At 19, you wouldn't be running equipment every day, for any contractor I know. Its climbing the ladder, you have to learn to walk before you can run. I think you have unrealistic expectations of your employer.
In the past many future operators started off as oilers and greased the machines and did basic maintainance. If the operator liked them would give them a lot of pointers and maybe even let them run the machine a bit at the end of the day or waiting for something else to be done before they could continue. Watching an experienced operator do a job can be awe inspiring how easy they make it look. It takes years of practice though. Hang in there, it sounds like they might want you driving a dump truck or something along those lines.
I'm not sure your current situation because, we are hearing your side of the story only, but I can say Don't move to fast. Make sure you're a master on the ground and the time will come that you get some seat time and you'll be really glad you have a full understanding of what needs to be done on the ground. Don't rush my friend.
That is a typical family owned construction company. The family members and friends will always get priority on running equipment instead of doing grunt work. You are fortunate that they sponsored you in the apprenticeship program. I'm certain they did that with full expectation that you would stay with them for a long time. In my local a business agent would not be too pleased to see you quit them and expect to be dispatched out of the hall.
Family businesses can be a pain if you're not family. My former neighbor ran a demolition company and even reading online reviews about family members always fighting and arguing. It took me over 2 month's to get paid on a 400K job. I heard from someone who worked on another even bigger job where there were problems and people were owed wages, the owners son drives up in a Corvette to tell the employee's the pay cheques will be 3 or 4 weeks late. Of course the son was paid first and didn't have to wait until the progress payments were released. The people contracting the job out held back the money because the job wasn't going as planned. Other family businesses run like clockwork and a good owner will reward and treat everyone with the same respect they deserve and promote the best people whether they are family or not.
Definitely need to get ahold of you’re business agent, he should have a talk with the owner and the card carrying operator’s to make sure you start doing apprenticeship operating.Don’t know what local you’re with,but my local (150) would correct this situation,we don’t do laborers work.
A potential problem might arise if the issue is pushed too hard. Best to clarify with your BA what course the company is planning for you. You don't want the company owner to resent you because you complained you're not operating yet.
I don't know about the local that you are currently in, but contractors in some locals can blacklist a union member if they have a problem with him or her. Which means you would be blocked from ever going back to that contractor. I was witness to it one time.
As a current small excavation company owner (family run), a former IUOE local 12 Member (actually I am still a member-I paid to "freeze" my status), and lastly from the perspective of a person with some employment experience, I have the following to offer. A lot of your options depend upon the agreement and expectations that were laid out when you were hired. If you did not find out exactly, or at least vaguely, what you should expect (I strongly suggest doing so), then you must understand that your employer might feel as if they are treating you well, and/or meeting their obligations and commitments to you, and you will never know if this is the case, or not. Any employment situation boils down to a contract (written or oral), or even more simply stated, an agreement between two persons. It is the responsibility of each party to understand what the terms are before they enter into the agreement. So far, it sounds like maybe you didn't get clear on what the agreement between you and your employer was/is. If you did, then I haven't read it within any of your posts. You mentioned something in your original post that has me wondering (based on responses) if anyone else read it. You wrote "I got into the IUOE apprenticeship and my then and still current employer “rehired” me off the books as they are a union contractor." What, exactly does this mean? The term "off the books" implies to me that you are not dispatched out of the hall as an operator (apprentice, journeyman, or other), and your employment is not being counted towards apprenticeship experience/hours, nor are you meeting qualifying hours for benefits, vacation, etc. (Technically, if they are signatory (with the union) they shouldn't be hiring "off the books"). If this is the case, it is pretty clear what capacity they are hiring you for, and your BA doesn't have much relevance to your employment there. If you talk to the BA, he will likely steer you towards trying to work "inside the union agreement". He has a duty (to the union and it's members) to do so, and the union makes money when you are employed within the union contract. Relative to your personal growth I also have some suggestions. You are very young. in your career. Based on what you have posted, it sounds like you have only been employed at this company for a year, or so. Wanting to run equipment is definitely important to getting that result, but having experience is more important (from my perspective). SO ask yourself: How do I get that experience? I started out as a laborer as well. I think most do/did. One of the most important things about being an operator is knowing what needs to be done and the best way to get it done. Much of that can be learned by observing others. Being a laborer (around heavy equipment) is probably the best way to get that experience. To that end...Be the best damn laborer in the company! Be a benefit to them! Take your desire to learn to operate and apply it in the situation that you are in now. Learn what needs to be done. Be a step ahead by knowing what needs to be done next and apply your efforts to that end. Take pride in what you do and show it by doing everything that you do well. Fully apply yourself to every task and show attention to detail (This will benefit you in every aspect of your life, not just employment). Show them that you are there to stay, and that they can trust you to operate the equipment (Operating equipment is a big responsibility, and it is a big risk for the employer). Offer to stay late, or work weekends, to be able to get equipment time. This company may be the best opportunity that you have to run heavy equipment. Sure, operating the equipment (if you do it well, don't break things, and/or do work that must be corrected) does benefit the company, but YOU are the one who benefits most from said experience. This is because YOU will be learning a skill that can benefit you for the rest of your life. The company will not benefit much if you take the skills that were acquired through the time and money invested in you by them, and leave their employment. In my experience, this idea is lost on most young people. This is how I climbed the ladder. I was driven to be the best. I was going to be the last person to go home if and when things got slow (remember, construction has had a lot of up and down cycles historically), and I was also going to be the first one moving up the ladder when the opportunities arose. As much as many of us want to be in denial about this, life is a competition....Be the BEST! Another way to gain experience is at the Union. Local 12 had an apprenticeship program. It was not simply signing up at the hall. One had to go to classes in the evening, and they also had a training trust that included heavy equipment, and a place to practice practical skills with that equipment. They also had, at least one, full time employee who would be there to train you in that equipment. Does your local union have this? If so, I suggest you invest some of your free time to building your skills. The last thing that I wanted to add to this discussion (also relevant to your personal growth) is that I have heard a lot of speculation within the posts of this thread. While a lot of the posters do not have direct contact with your employer (thus they must speculate) you, on the other hand, do have direct contact with them. I am wondering why you are speculating on what to expect from them....Why you don't know what they see in you, and how they might use you going forward. Even more to the point, what you must do for them to put you in the equipment more. I believe that there is only one way to end that speculation. That is for you to ask them directly. I suggest that you go to the person (within your company) who has the power to make those decisions, and tell them what you are looking for in your employment. Ask this person if that would be possible for you, and what you can do to make that happen. Then you can take ownership (and responsibility) for your career. You can decide if you are willing to take those steps, or not. If you decide to stick with it, and as your employment progresses, then you will be able to go back to this person and ask how you are doing, and what you must do to reach your goals. Keep at it...Keep showing your intention, and keep your part of the bargain. If they do not then you will be on high ground if you decide to leave their employ. I know that I have said a lot. I hope that this does not come across as condescending as I am not trying to berate you, or judge you in any way. I am simply offering what I believe to be good suggestions from the perspective of what I have experienced (successes and failures) in my life and career. I hope that you can hear it and benefit from it. Good luck!!
In your 1st post you said "I got into the IUOE apprenticeship and my then and still current employer “rehired” me off the books as they are a union contractor. " I didn't understand that the first time I read it and I still don't. Also I wondered, actually confused by what you meant in post #7 ---> "I’m contracted as a heavy equipment operator, my co workers can be tough to get along with but I don’t really care I can manage it."
It sounds to me like he was working for this company but to become an operator he basically had to quit, join the union and get hired back as an apprentice under the union. I don't get the "contracted as" though. To me that sounds like a sub-contractor brought in to do a specific task for another company. Some clarification would be helpful.