How well do jaw buckets work? I just got a Cat 308D excavator and was looking at getting a thumb for it but the bucket that came with it isn't in great shape either and will likely be getting another bucket. Most of my use will be digging trenches and taking out sage brush. The soil here is caliche and I have a fair amount or rocks as well. To me it seems like the jaw bucket would be useful but I don't have the experience to know. Often times multiuse items end up not doing anything well. My excavator came with a hydraulic pin grabber. Is it common to change the mounting bosses on buckets? So far the best price I have seen for a jaw bucket the pins are 45mm vs the 50mm my machine uses and I think different spacing between pins. On the hydraulics needed to operate it. My machine has the pin grabber connected to the aux lines, is there a way to use both from the aux lines or do I need to run another set of lines? I don't really understand how the pin grabber hydraulics work. I looks like they intend accessories to be able to be connected at the same time to the hydraulic lines so I'm hopeful it don't need to run extra lines, of course I could change it to a manual pin grabber I have to disconnect the hydraulic lines to the bucket anyways. Thank you.
Just wondering what you mean by a jaw bucket? Is it ahydraulic clam bucket you are thinking of?
If I am tracking what your saying, get a thumb, and forget about a bucket jaw bucket. If you need a new bucket, than get a typical dirt bucket. A jaw bucket will limit what you can grab, a thumb is much more versatile. I am not sure how your arm hyd. are set up. You might post some pics so that everyone can see it.
Are you talking about a Clam bucket? I once looked into a rotating clam bucket for rockery work. Very expensive. They are heavy so you need a big machine. But no problem for you, as you have a 9 ton machine. The Company I looked at was called Towtem Atachments in WA. It's a nice attachment.
Id go with a thumb,make sure the geometry matches your bucket and the pin grabber and the end of the thumb misses your bucket teeth when closed. Stay away from the foot pedal control and have a rocker switch on your boom lever.
I had to look around to figure out what he was talking about. Yeah no way would I do that. I find myself switching to various sized buckets for different jobs and that thing would do a few things okay? And a whole bunch of things poorly like cleanup work. Stick with a thumb and multiple buckets. It won't grab as much as a thumb and bucket. It won't lift as much. It weighs more. It has a long list of problems. When you get into really hard digging, you're going to beat the snot out of that mechanism for no good reason at all.
Thanks. What Skyking1 posted is the type of bucket I was looking at. From the sounds of it I'll be getting normal buckets and a thumb. Does the same thumb work with multiple size buckets? I figure for the most part I don't need to cover the bucket so I should be able to have a thumb sized for the narrowest bucket and have it work with the wider buckets. I'm not sure about teeth spacing on buckets but as long as they are my buckets I can reposition the teeth as needed.
It's OK if the thumb tines land on the bucket teeth. My 120 setup is good, the thumb is made for the 3' GP bucket, but is not bad with the 2' trenching bucket. It has a big overbite on the cleanup 4' and that is usually the case. Those buckets are designed for more width and ease of release. The 3' bucket is the ideal fit. The 2' with the tigers. If I put 4 new twin tigers on there I could probably tie shoe laces with it. I can't find the overbite picture with the cleanup.
Like Sky said it's OK if the thumb tines hit the teeth especially on a mini/midi excavator. The hydro thumb on our 305E only meshes with our 24" bucket however we have an 18" and 36" with cutting edge welded on the teeth for a poor man's smooth bucket. The thumb actually works the best with the 36" "smooth" bucket for what we do.
somebody will have a suggestion for the hydraulics. I have manual valves out there to lock off the thumb and use the juice for the hoe pack. There should be something similar for a pin grabber. Get the bucket picked up and then lock off that part and get to use the thumb.
I don't know why I thought the coupler was attached to the aux lines. The coupler has 2 lines that are by themselves. It looks like they had a thumb before and it was attached with tees to the aux lines. They took the thumb and put on their worst bucket I'm sure. It makes sense to swap the bucket to the one you don't want anymore if selling a machine especially if it is super easy to swap. Ran out of grease before I completed greasing it. I am so happy I got an electric grease gun before the excavator. Slowly learning how to operate it. I need to check the other control options. A few of the controls don't seem to be where I want them as I keep moving the wrong joystick. Not sure if any of the other 3 options will work better for me or if it is just a matter of seat time and I will learn controls eventually.
A 308D should have a pattern changer. Post of the serial # and I'll see what I can find on SIS. Pick which pattern you feel the most comfortable running.
there is a thumb cylinder mount on the stick?
Serial # is CAT0308DCGBT00128 . It does have a pattern changer, looked like it has 4 positions. I need to look at the various options and see if one matches my current habits. Edit : After reviewing the options looks like position D might be close. It is Former SCM machine control pattern and the left joystick left/right controls the stick in/out and front to back is the swing. Not sure why that is how I tend to try to operate it but it is. I only have a few hours in a cab of an excavator so it isn't like I'm used to certain controls. Yes there is a thumb cylinder mount on the stick and also the pins attaching the coupler to the stick are extra long. Is the thumb cylinder mount only installed if it has a thumb? I just assumed it would normally have the mount even if it didn't come with a thumb at least until you got to the larger machines that thumbs aren't common.
You might just be able to chase down the parts and put that thumb together.
Change the pattern to standard excavator pattern and learn it, you’ll be glad you did down the road. In my opinion a person needs to learn the proper patterens for different machines and not go changing them all the time. In my mind excavators use one pattern and backhoes use another, it’s not hard to learn both. I’ve forced myself to learn and become proficient at excavator patteren, two stick backhoe, and three stick Case backhoe. What messes me up is when someone has switched them, put me in an excavator set to backhoe pattern or vice versa and I can hardly hit the ground with the bucket.
It is one of the reasons I am fond of case backhoes. There is no similarity, nothing to re-learn or re-jigger in your brain. I can be on a job with a case and an excavator and jump back and forth without a thought.
This should be the pattern changer on your machine.
I disagree. Run which pattern you are comfortable and productive with. Could care less which pattern the operator uses as long as they are safe and profitable. That's why machines have pattern changers. Thanks Nige.
I have thought about learning the normal pattern would be better if I ever operate another excavator. On the other hand I am not going to be an operator and don't see me using another machine. I'm going to change the pattern and try it and see if it helps me. If I'm still having learning issues then I will put it back and learn the normal pattern. I don't see any reason to struggle learning a pattern that isn't intuitive for me if I can turn a valve and use a pattern that is.
I have thought about learning the normal pattern would be better if I ever operate another excavator. On the other hand I am not going to be an operator and don't see me using another machine. I'm going to change the pattern and try it and see if it helps me. If I'm still having learning issues then I will put it back and learn the normal pattern. I don't see any reason to struggle learning a pattern that isn't intuitive for me if I can turn a valve and use a pattern that is.
Agree 100%. The argument over which excavator pattern is "best" is akin to whether a Chevy is better than a Ford or a Komatsu is better than a Cat. It's a never ending argument for the sake of argument. Not worth the time IMO. Like the tagline says - Take what you win and run what you brung - (with the pattern you like running).
I rented a small excavator for a weekend project before i owned my 303.5Cat.It came set for John Deere controls ,my wife ran it better than i did until i figured how to change it over to SAE.
Well only 2.5 positions work and not the one I wanted to try. One position none of the joystick controls work. Another position only the right joystick seems to work. I need to see how to access the valve to see what is going on. I just realized what I was thinking isn't going to be the issue. I was thinking maybe a set of lines was leaking so they capped them off but all the lines are the same. It is only changing things inside the valve block. So I guess now I need to verify they have the correct valve installed and make sure the handle is clocked right to the valve. I guess I should figure out which patterns work as that may indicate what is going on. The 2 positions that work change which joystick controls the arm vs the boom. Both swing is on the left joystick left/right and the bucket curl is on the right joystick left/right. The boom and arm however switch between. I can't remember which functions worked in the other position.
So looks like I only have a 2 way valve and not a 4 way. My options are SAE and BHL. Looks like the 2 way valve is $10k and I can't imagine a 4 way valve is going to be cheaper. So I guess I will practice with SAE and see if I can stop trying to swing the boom when I want to move the arm. I'm not motivated enough to try and figure out moving lines around to change the pattern to SCM.
Looks like I can change 8 lines on the 2 way valve and configure it to be SAE or SCM. If I change hoses on the 2 way valve C and F A and H 7 and 3 5 and 1 That should change it so it is SAE or SCM. Would need to get new films to post on the windows with the control patterns. I'll check tomorrow to see how difficult it is to get to the lines.
I think your overthinking this, by a long shot. Your not operator, so latch on to the SAE while your learning, which I believe is what is commonly known as CAT controls. I learned on backhoe or Deere controls, and I switched to CAT. Thousands of hours on Deere controls and I switched. I think you just haven't spent enough time on it. If you have SAE and BHL (deere) just leave it.
ISO or Cat pattern is the best, because it is the only pattern I can run . . .