I have an 05 jd 250 series II with 1030 hrs. I've had it little over a year so not sure of past maintenance or repair. I have two major problems, the most pressing is that it wont start. I used it last Friday and again on Saturday; ran fine. On Sunday it would turn over, but it did not fire a single time and hasn't over the days and many times I have tried it since. I'm keeping the battery charged as I try it. it took a spell of not starting a year ago not long after I got it. it wouldn't even turn over; blew the starter fuse instantly when I turned the key. That time I found that unplugging the temp sensor (auto heat circuit I think) on the block right above and wired to the injector pump stopped the fuse blowing and it started right up and ran until Sunday. The temp sensor is still unplugged. I have not changed anything, but I checked the primary fuel pump at the fuel water separator/ filter. Seems to be pumping but I didn't check pressure. Also, I removed a fuel line from the first injector and got nothing when I cranked it. True confession time: I added 5gal fuel on Saturday and used it another hour or two before I shut it down. That can had about a gal old fuel in it when I filled it with fresh fuel and 16oz of Seafoam. On Sun I added another 5gal of fresh fuel. I lifted out the fuel pickup tube from the fuel tank. I couldn't detect and fuel gelling or trash or anything like that. It seems to me (the one who doesn't have clue) like a fuel delivery problem, not a fuel quality problem since it ran fine after I put in some old fuel. And now it doesn't try to start or start and run rough. I saw in another thread someone mentioned jumpering too or around the solenoid valve in the injector pump as a test. Can anyone help me with this, or bad idea? Thanks ahead Joe
I'm assuming you have a simple rotary injection pump, because I know nothing about this machine or the heat circuit you mentioned. You could run a test lead to the solenoid terminal on the pump and see if you get power in the on and start position. If you have 12V at the pump then there's no reason to jumper to it. If you don't have power then figure out why, or jumper it if you want the immediate gratification of hearing it run, and then figure out why it doesn't have power.
Thanks Delmer. I don't know what I mean by heat circuit for sure either. the spec sheet from JD lists 'airheat cold start' as a feature and 'Auto Preheat' as an option. I don't know for sure what either is or whether my 250 has the optional preheat. that said, the temp sensor seems to be part of the injector solenoid interlock system, as one wire from the sensor goes directly to a terminal on top of the injector pump, the other goes into the wiring harness. I appreciate your suggestion; i'll try it the next time I can work on it. I would like to hotwire it temporarily so I can get it out of my front yard. I seeded all around it since I couldn't get out of the way. thanks
I managed to get a mirror under the pump and found out it is a Standyne DB4. it is a mechanical rotary pump with a number of mechanisms for controlling the advance up to 14 deg. including a cold start/ warmup advance and a slow speed setting, in addition to the fuel shutoff solenoid. I found this list of features but I cant find a digramm that shows which tderminal is which. does anybody have one. could a weak battery be a problem. im keeping the batt charged, but never goes over 13 v even fully charged according to the charger. I swapped the relays around, but I suppose it could still be a relay or two. im try best I can to avoid a service call. tdhis thing is not a money maker. I got it to use when my daughter and soninlaw built a house. that took over a year an the first time I bring it home to work on my place, it goes dead. I can see $500 floating away by the time they come out, drag it to the street load it haul it and take off the pump. and that's all before they6 start talking parts and reassembling it. oh well, enough whining. I took the risk. any info is greatly appreciated. joe
I found this on standyune brochure online: "For example, Stanadyne has introduced an improved cold advance - servo light load advance mechanism for its DB4 pumps with up to fourteen pump degrees of range. Cold advance is additive to the light load advance schedule rather than a fixed amount." I don't kno what to make of it because seems like the advance mech wouldn't keep itd from firing, although it might be making the start fuse blow when I plug in the temp sensor above the pump. im finding all kind of stuff that's in this pump but I cant find a digram to show me dwhich terminal is which. does any one have a standyne db4 wire diagram. im out today till late. if you can send a digram i'll get back to you tonite or tomorrow morn. thx joe
How many terminals does your pump have. My DB4 has two electrical post terminals, one is the "on" wire from the key, and the other is the ground- it's just hooked to one of the screws on the body of the pump. If you have those same two terminals then you can hotwire one and make sure the other is grounded, should hear a click when you hook up the hot. As far as I know, there is only a shut off on this pump, everything else is internal and automatic, except the throttle/speed. Do you get white smoke or mist out of the exhaust when you crank it? If there's no mist there's no fuel and we can ignore all the heat-start features for now, and figure out why there isn't fuel. A weak battery would make it crank too slow, how does it sound when you crank it? 13v is a little low but that depends on the charger, meter, etc. Again, if there's no mist, ignore the battery until you figure out how to get fuel.
The shut off solenoids are prone to failure on the DB and DM series of pumps. you will find the solenoid under the top cover of the pump. It is a serviceable part. However....beware that the screws that hold said cover on are likely to break when you try to remove them and be siezed into the pump body.
thx Delmer and cutting edge. pump has two terminals; one has a little ground strap to the case. couldn't work on it today, but i'll try to put 12v to the other term tomorrow to see if I can hear movement and start it. no smoke or mist out the exhaust when I crank it. so i'm gonna focus on the fuel shutoff. i'm keeping the batt at 100% between tries, but it just doesn't sound like its turning over as fast as it should, or used to. maybe I can attach another battery. with the arms down I cant change out the batt. also I can barely touch the inj pump with my fingertips because of the arms and fuel tank covering up side access. servicing the solenoid is gonna be a bear, but that seems to be the best chance. also, can the skid steer be towed dead?
Have you tried changing the fuel filter?The start fuse will blow because of the advance solenoid on the pump.Check the rest of your fuses as that may be your problem.Or you can check for voltage at the top of the pump and hotwire a connection to the battery.
sorry for the long absence and thx for input! I just bought a new filter but havnt installed yet. I did jump to the front terminal (non grnd) on the inj pump. I could hear the solenoid click when I attached the wire, but still wouldn't fire and didn't produce any fuel at the injector when I checked. so I pulled the lift pump and primary filter off and hotwired; seems to pump a rapid flow under no load but I cant check pressure. I took it off because I tried to do the same thing with it in place, and it seemed to click and sputter but not run strong. when I can I will test the pump for continuity to see if it is erratic or unclear and then run it for a while to see if it keeps going. after that, i'll clean the water separator filter or change it. after that, I don't know what else to do. I think I have read that this engine does not need to be bled. is that right?
It sounds like you need to get to the bottom of why the pump is "sputtering". Maybe the injection pump is supposed to bleed itself with the electric transfer pump, but it is reassuring to crack a bleed screw and get a good spray of fuel with no bubbles. Don't worry about the pressure for now, if you get the volume looking good it doesn't need much pressure, or really much volume either. On second thought, the clicking and sputtering you heard with the pump in place MAY be normal for an electric transfer pump (running only to maintain the pressure). If you open a bleeder screw and relieve the pressure the pump should pump smoothly. If not, you could take the suction and stick it in a container of fuel to see if it sounds better (might be pulling a vacuum from the tank). If the alternate fuel source makes the pump run smoother, try to start it that way.
Just change the filter!!!
I changed the primary filter, the inline between the tank and lift pump. I unhooked the fuel line at the water separator filter and after it primed, got a good, continuous flow from the lift pump. I could not get the separator pump off because I did not have a tool that would work in the confined space and my hands aren't strong enough in the awkward situation. when I get the right equip I will change that filter and/or crack a fitting on the output side of the filter or on the other end of the fuel line where it connects to the inj pump. thanks guys
Sorry for the late close the loop. Problem turned out to be frozen injection pump. Cause unknown. $2700 included reman JD pump, one new injector and cleaning the other two, plus transport. Thanks to all for help. Ideas and advice were all right on target; just not possible to dodge the bill this time. Oh well. Now on to the leaking parking brake.
the pump froze because you have water in your fuel.That is about the only thing that will do in the pump.I suggest you drain your fuel tank and invest in a new cap.Way cheaper than another $2700. The parking brake is the motor seal (hydrostatic) Not to bad of a job once you get all the crap out of the way.
Thanks joeblow and roger the new cap. tank was drained as part of the pump job. also, im about to start a thread for the brake job, some time today, in a few minutes i hope. appreciate it if you look at it an comment when i get it on here. thanks again. joe
xxx
Delmar, Not sure if you know the pump or the machine. I have a JD skid steer 240 II series and my shut off solenoid is not powered. I have checked the only fuses I know of inside the cab and they are all good. I have run a jumper wire from the battery and my machine fires right up and runs great. Do you happen to know where this solenoid gets power from. Right now I have a fused wire running to an ignition feed but I'd rather fix the real problem.
there is a fuel pump relay under the fuse block .It is the closest to the front .You have to lift the cab to see it.(easy to do just undo the 2 nuts at either side of the cab and lift the front ,if it sticks use a crowbar)Try swapping it with the relay closest to the rear of the machine. (acc relay)
Thank you joeblow. I've had the cab up before to replace one of the brake lines. Cab up easy (other than my support struts are very weak) changing the non flexible line that is routed under everything else, not fun. I'll check out the relay, thank you for the info. I was a bit worried about this when the machine did not start. I was an automotive tech for 17 years before starting my own business but only very limited diesel education from Tech College I went to 25 years ago.