was cleaning out my burn hole the other day,idling in to position ,when i heard a loud squeal,and then something went snap,the engine was still running fine,but i soon saw smoke coming from the front of the engine so i shut it down.upon inspection i didnt see anything,so i fired her back up got down to look at the front of the engine ,and nothing was turning,not fan blade not balancer or front pump.i had to get her back in to the shed which took me about 30 seconds which was not easy without any power steering,because i had no hydraulics.took it apart today,and found a broken harmonic balancer,which also destroyed the key slot in the crank,and also a seized up hydraulic pump,which one do you think would have happened first? this is really disappointing to me,and will be quite a big and expensive job,but i dont want it to happen again,thanks for looking.
What happened in the pump? Something get pulled into a chamber?
Pump seized first, no other way that much damage occurred. That machine is really not worth repairing at that point, unless you're in love with it I'm afraid. Usually the coupler breaks, I think it's supposed to anyway, rather than destroy the crankshaft.
Maybe a bearing seized up, making the squeal, then the balancer came apart. Take the pump apart and see. I'd be replacing the pulley by cutting a keyway on the other side of the crankshaft, by hand if needed.
i,v never had one of those pumps apart, but it looks like i am gonna have to take a look inside.it really caught me by surprise,considering the old girl had been operating just fine up until that point. i was wondering if maybe the balancer came apart first,then shoved forward on the pump and lost all of its endplay and maybe seized the pump that way.
Lantraxco's probably right, if you need a new pump and a new crankshaft, that's pretty well totaled. On the other hand, you have nothing to lose by taking the pump apart at this point. I believe you can take the bolts out that go through the two halves of the case axially and split it without removing any of the valves and pistons (the eight "hex plugs" on the front, and eight on the outside diameter). Those will have to come out to put it back together I think, but not to take it apart and throw it in a box to sit in the cab until whenever.
There are 4 bolts in the front cover which will remove only it. The bearing can then be knocked out as the front race is held in the case. After removing the bearing, you can then see what happened inside. The shaft won't come out without removing the radial caps and pistons. Likely a piston cracked and split and got between the cam and housing. I've had to replace drive shaft after one did that but it didn't damage the crank. As far as the damaged key way goes, did it badly damage the stub? if it only took the side out of the key slot, I would weld it up and hand cut it back out with a die grinder. That isn't a machine killing incident and I sure wouldn't replace the crank for it.
the crank snout doesnt look real bad,the keyway is probably about 50 percent wider than it should be,i think i will probably purchase a new balancer for the front of the crank and see if it feels good when i put it on,to make sure the diameter of the crank snout is decent.not sure if this is a press fit like some automotive balancers,or a slide on fit. as far as the pump goes,i think i will take those bolts out and look inside,still seem to think that the balancer caused my problems,and not the pump,but i geuss i find that out.thanks everyone for the responses,your help is greatly appreciated.
if the key way in the crank is just worn wider, but can still hold the key, have the new balancer slot machined to accept a wider key so it fits tight on the crank..
Crank snout is straight, no taper. Not a press fit. Bolt will pull it back on. There is no balancer between the crank and the pump. It is outside the drive hub and would only slip around it if anything. Your pump self destructed and locked up. Seen it before but the cast iron hollow driveshaft shaft was the weak link and didn't hurt anything else. Early machines had a split coupling clamped around rubber bushings on drive pins, later machines used a rubber damper donut to drive the pump.
all of the pump drive components,including the cast iron coupler,aluminum drive plates,and plastic isolator are in excellent condition,i would have thought that the coupler would have broken first,but i geuss stranger things have happened.
finally got my pump apart,it looks like a bomb went off inside of it.it took me about 45 minutes just to get all the broken pieces out of the housing,everything inside is destroyed,but nothing looks like it got hot and seized,broken bearing races and broken needle bearings.i am going to fix the backhoe,but i am worried that this could happen again,any suggestions on what to look for would be greatly appreciated,thanks for looking.
At least one, maybe two complete hydraulic system flushes will need to be done.
i agree,any ideas on what makes a supposedly good working pump explode?
I've never tried or done it but I was warned years ago never to dead head the pump or it would blow up.Actually I was told it would break the pump housing.
I suppose it's possible the pressure control malfunctioned somehow and caused a pressure spike. It's not exactly new, and even if it was new, a certain percentage of anything just fails, not much point in trying to figure out why it blew up, I don't think Deere is going to recall it. If it happened suddenly there's a better chance the rest of the system is fine, as opposed to the pump grinding itself to death and spreading metal flakes to every hose, valve and cylinder. It's possible you don't have anything past the line out of the pump, take a few hoses apart downstream of the pump and blow them out into a separate clean bucket for each one, you'll see how far the metal went. Also, those old pumps are somewhat interchangeable, that is they're internally pressure regulated, so you can make another deere radial pump work.
well i finally got the old 310a back together.i rebuilt the engine,rebuilt the front clutch pack,and removed the reverse brake,inspected the clutches,and resealed everything.when i got the fuel system bled out,it fired right up,idle a little funny for about 5 minutes,and then smoothed right out,i would really like to thank everyone on this forum,that responded and gave me some really good tips,i would also like to thank jerry at kintech ,for selling me a really great rebuilt pump at a fair price the old girl is operating great again,thanks again everyone for the help, Steve
Good show nice to hear your up and running !!!
Nice job,pretty quick too!
I was following this thread as my JD 310A just broke a hydraulic pump drive shaft. No smoke, no noise, just one minute I had hydraulics, the next nothing. The two ears that bolt to the aluminum plate snapped right off. Both halves of the the aluminum coupling and the rubber insert are fine. My initial thought was that it was just fatigue, as there was dirt and oil in parts of the break area, but from some of the remarks on here I have a concern that it could be a pump problem. I have turned the pump shaft over by hand and there is no obvious sounds. As long as the front of the engine is apart I am replacing the water pump, radiator hoses, fan belt and boiling out the radiator. I should mention this is a home use machine only. Thank you in advance for your advice. Ron
!Old thread warning! Catsron, If it was me, I'd put the pump drive back together and try it out for five minutes or so, BEFORE I pulled the water pump etc. If it doesn't work, you don't want to sink all that work into it first. Also, I wouldn't boil out a radiator without a real good reason, even if it's got some scale, I'd run it with rainwater for an hour, flush and repeat until you're happy, then start over with new coolant. Probably same with the water pump, if it's not leaking or loose in the bearing, leave it. I trust OEM better than what you get these days. Rubber parts, go for it, consider the front crankshaft seal too.
Thank you Delmar. I will hold off on the radiator. The water pump has a bad bearing so that needs to be changed or rebuilt. I will start the tractor as soon as I get the hydraulic system in one piece.
What you describe makes me think the crankshaft bolt came loose (or sheared) and caused the failure. The vibration and wobbling would certainly cause those two little ears to break off. The front of the crankshaft may have taken a beating from the damper. Look at the damper shaft and to see if it looks like it was pounding the crankshaft. I would bet the pump is okay.
Thank you Tinkerer. I will check the crank shaft side to make sure everything is tight. I agree with you (and hope) the pump is fine. I can turn the pump over by hand with no noise or feeling of broken parts. It just came to me that if I turn the ignition switch on, that should activate the unloaded solenoid to make it easier to turn pump by hand.