My 410G when cold will pull decently in 1st and 2nd barely in 3rd and very little in 4th. After ten minutes of warmup it will shifting to 3rd or 4th is almost not detectable. it will still work in 1st and 2nd but is easy to stall. I thought it was probably clutch packs but am wondering if I have a bad torque convertor. Would like to be pretty sure before starting to work on it. Would appreciate any any ideas.
Also the transmission pressures check good and there was not a lot of residue in the oil filter 2003 model
Welcome to HEF ByPromise ! Machine serial number please. Perform a converter stall test. Transmission at operating temperature, 3rd gear, foot firmly on the brake, place in forward then go to full throttle. What engine rpm do you have? Oil level is good? What oil are you using in the transmission? Post what pressures you checked and the psi. Maybe brake drag? On flat ground, release the park brake, will it roll in 1st forward with your foot off the brake? If you are on a hill, will it roll when the PB is released? Pictures of the filter contents?
It will be a couple days before I can do any more checks. It rolls easily when brake is released in neutral. I have been reluctant to do a stall test because I didn't want to burn up clutch packs but that probably doesn't matter now. I've broken off allen wrenches trying to get some of the plugs out but 1st and 3rd and system pressures all check the same above 250 and 0 when disengaged. Jd oil and filter dealer looked at filter and had some clutch residue in it but didn't seem like an inordinate amount. I'm pretty sure when I do a stall test warm in 3rd the rpms will almost not notice much resistance because I've still been using a little and when it's warm in 3rd I can throttle up and doesn't hardly try to move but I will done Saturday. Thanks
I would also check the transmission oil dipstick when backhoe is at operating temperature for foam. Aeration of the oil might be happening.
serial # T0410GX896621 2001 model with Cab RPM 2320 in 3rd with brake released (or any other gear). I Was wrong on pressure it's 200 PSI which is below spec. Yes there is foam on dipstick. I had noticed that previously too.
parking brake that is holding footbrakes obviously Thanks for your input
200 psi and foamy? Are you checking the transmission oil with the engine running? Check that the transmission breather is clear. See bottom image below for location. If your transmission oil level is good with the engine idling and your breather is clear, then drain the oil. If I recall, you can look into the drain plug opening and see the oil pickup. Does the screen on the pickup look something like this:
I am checking oil while running although i'm not sure of level because of the foaminess. I removed the breather and cleaned it. I don't think it was dirty enough or plugged enough to cause a problem. I recently changed the oil and looked at the intake. I couldn't see any blockage although the screen is up inside the tube and difficult to inspect. I can understand foaming would reduce torque in the converter. Would it also reduce system pressure? What else could cause the foaming? Thanks, I really appreciate your help.
I will check this after noon to see if cleaning the breather made any difference
So what might be going on is that friction material from your clutch plates are stopping up the screen on your pickup tube which in turn causes the transmission pump to pull air in around the o-ring(s) that connect the pump to the transmission. A break in figuring out my own transmission was that my son could hear a very high pitched squeal when my backhoe was running and foaming the transmission fluid. That's a very powerful pump and it pulls from wherever it can. If this is what's happening, you need to stop using that tractor until it's repaired. The pump is directly driven from the crankshaft and can wreck itself with a stopped up pickup screen. Been there, done that.
Here is a good read for you. HeavyEquipmentForums
It didn't help to clean the breather. As soon as it is running before the oil gets very foamy it still doesn't pull well. It begins to foam quickly and transmission pressure drops from 250 down to 200 in the same time frame. Of course the oil is still not warmed up at that point. Could the torque converter itself cause foaming? I don't want to take the transmission itself apart unless I know something is wrong in there. I'm sure the screen is not very clogged and when I changed the oil there wasn't debris in the transmission.
Did you strain the transmission fluid through a filter of some kind. I would inspect that fluid for debris. That transmission pulls fluid from the sump area and it travels about 2 ft to the pump. The rest of the way the pump pushes the fluid. That pickup tube pictured above could be cracked, there is an 0-ring at the top of the tube that could be bad. O-ring at the pumps inlet could be bad. Once the transmission fluid leaves the charge pump it is getting pushed through the transmission. I'm not an expert, but it seems to me the most likely area for foaming is on the suction side of things. Are you using John Deere's recommended fluid in the transmission?
Yes I am using jd recommended fluid. I didn't strain it but I did put it back in a clean container. I will look at it again.
Hi, sorry for jumping in on this conversation but I'm about to go look at a 04 JD 410G, the transmission was rebuilt in 23. What am I looking for when performing a stall test? Thanks
@blacky705 Please provide a machine serial number. There are different specs based on that information. I'll PM the necessary info when I receive the serial. Also, if you have more questions, please start your own thread with all the particulars as to why you need this information rather than piggy backing this thread.
T0410CX904427 thanks
@blacky705 Check your messages.
I wouldn't take doing a stall test lightly. Maybe I'm overly cautious, but I'm not doing that to my backhoe unless I suspect an issue with it.
He says the transmission was rebuilt in 2023, he still needs to send me the receipts for the maintenance and repairs on it.
While preforming a stall test sounds horrible for the machine, if the machine is in decent operating condition, the stall test doesn’t hurt it. Thats what a torque converter is for. I will admit, it feels like you’re hurting it but it’s no different than backing out of a hole, it can’t make it out of, in the gear it’s in.