I need help dis assembeling the cylinder I removed the outside snap ring and drove the gland back . but I don't see a spilt ring to remove inside the tube. HELP! thank's
I can't make heads or tails of jdparts diagrams on this one, seems like you could have any cylinder they ever built. There should be a round wire ring in the groove in the internal diameter of the cylinder barrel, just push the ridge back with a screwdriver and the wire will hop out of the groove. The groove is sloped toward the inside and has a shoulder going out.
thanks Delmer, the problem is there is no ring in the groove , im wondering if It could have popped inside the cylinder tube when I drove the gland back. there is no ring and the rod won'tcome out of the tube ?
You're screwed. Sorry for explaining the obvious with that last post, all I could figure is you were looking for a snap ring, not a wire ring. Something would have to be seriously wrong for the ring to ride up out of the groove with the gland, the gland is supposed to be tight enough to keep that ring in it's groove, until you drive it back of course. Do you have the orange plastic "wedge ring" that goes in the groove to let the o-rings slide over that groove? if not the o-rings will hang up and tear as you knock the gland out. Did you put the pin back in the rod and bang on that to get the rod/gland out of the barrel? If the cylinder is still on the machine, try extending it and see what happens. Or post a pic, I might be thinking of a different style gland?
Delmer, the new seal kit did not come with the orange wedge ring im gonna try putting the pin back in and banging on it to get the rod out when I get back to the shop.i have done others on this dozer without this problem,i just don't want to mess anything up trying to pull the rod out. thanks for the help jd
Wrap the chrome part of the rod with heavy rags or thick aluminum sheet metal before banging on the pin, just in case you miss. If the gland doesn't come out, you might have succeeded in reseating the ring, try pushing the gland back in a few times to see if you can get the ring out.
If you dont have the wedge ring you are going to have to build one. Alternate fill grove with bondo.
Thanks for the help guys I called a friend of a friend yesterday , he said on that type of cylinder when you drive the gland back the ring does go back with the gland. And the wedge ring in the kit will let the ring pass on the way out, my problem now is I need to get herculese to send me the wedge ring. Anyways its not as bad as I feared , just a couple more days wait. Thanks, jd
jd mad, I'm rebuilding my 450H LGP angle cylinders. Can you tell me what the wedge ring looks like? I think I can pick the right one, but don't want to make a mistake. I just rebuild the two lift cylinders (quite a bit of work to hone and still left some small pits at the gland oring). Then I moved on to the angle cylinders. I was thought that I was screwed when I did not find the lock ring. I had already planned on making a wedge ring when I found this thread. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks.
I think I have found the correct orange wedge ring in the kit. I have to be sure, because it is a plastic ring . And, I will have to cut it in order to place it in the groove. Since the cylinder is still assembled, I have to cut it.
ac you should not have to cut the split ring they are a presice fit you may have it turned the wrong direction. disconnect the hoses ,disconnect the pin that goes to the blade ( if you are going to re build without removing the whole cyl.) push the rod back in the tube a few inches ,install the split removal ring into the groove .it seats better only one way you may have to flip it around to find the right direction .smear a little grease inside the tube around the removal ring and pull out the rod/gland assembly.reverse order to re install in the tube I responded to an email from heavy equip. forums about your post earlier this morning I guess it didn't go through good luck jd
jd, Thanks for the response. To help anyone else that might have a similiar problem. I purchases a Bulldog kit and it did not come with a split wedge ring. Instead, it can with a non-split (orange) wedge ring. I verfied that it was the correct wedge tool (way too large of a diameter to be used on the gland/rod guide or packing). Then I cut/split it and placed it in the groove. It was easy to determine which orientation was correct (just make it lay flat in the groove). After spliting it, it was still about 3/4" to long. I snipped off the proper amount and placed it back in the groove. Then the rod guide/lock ring passed over the groove without any problems. I now have completed the two lift cylinders and one of the angle cylinders. The last angle cylinder should be much easier now that I figured out the first one. I haven't had any help, but most of the cylinder pins have come out relatively easy. I haven't gotten the last angle cylinder off, yet. I may have to get someone to hold a big punch, while I swing a bigger sledge. Angle cylinder bushing are not too loose, but one is cracked (outer race around the ball). I hate spending more money, but I may replace all the ball bushings on the angle cylinders. Do you know an inexpensive source for them? FYI, JD dealer wanted $800 in labor to do the two lift and two angle cylinders. Thanks again, and I hope this helps someone else save a few dollars.
ac , hope the info helped this is a great web site the folks here have helped me out a few times in the past and probably more to come in the future!!!! thanks,jd
I am fighting this same issue right now and could use some information. I got the bulldog kit with the orange ring that I had to split. It looks like someone has tried to get in this thing before me. I took the cylinder off the machine. I Removed the circle clip off gland. I installed the orange ring on gland where clip was. I knocked gland into the tube as far as it will go. This is the problem. There is nothing to remove in there. All there is is a circle grove in the tube about 1/2 inch in. I am trying to pull the rod and gland back out and the gland will not come out now. Please let me know what I am doing wrong. Thank you
A pic might help straighten things out. It sounds like the orange ring is in the wrong place, it goes in the inside of the tube, not on the gland, if it's what I'm thinking it is. There is a wire ring inside there, or else the gland would have popped out in use. Use the cylinder rod to ram the gland back out, then push the gland back in just enough to see the groove. The ring probably went back with the gland. Pull the ring out with an o ring pick. They do build up a ridge on the tube where the ring sits, that keeps the gland from coming out easy. You can try to sand it smooth, but probably have to get the gland out, then sand down the ridge, then hope the new seals go over the ridge OK.
Well that explains a lot. The problem is I drove it in with the orange ring on the outside of the gland. Now the gland won't come back out. I drove the gland in until it wouldn't go anymore and never saw a wire ring. How far is this wire ring in the tube?
You're going to have to pull the rod out with force. If you'd left it on the machine it would pop out easy with the hydraulics. The ring is in the internal groove of the tube when the gland is locked, but yours is probably stuck to the gland right now.
I ended up putting it back on the dozer and using the hydraulics to push the gland back out. It messed my orange ring up in the process. Do you know if just the tool is available rather then having to buy the whole kit? Also, there is definitely no ring in there. If I get a new tool and install it properly and use the machine to push gland out then will that ring come out with it? Thanks
if there's no ring, then I need a picture, because it's not what I'm thinking of. JDparts.com show it should be just like any other JD cylinder of that style. It's a ROUND CROSS SECTION ring, looks just like a piece of wire, and it's there or the gland and piston would pop right out of the cylinder the first time it's extended. "blade angle hydraulic cylinder 450H" in jdparts, #3 is an internal snap ring.