My nearby dealer has a KX040 sitting on the lot. I'm thinking about picking it up because I want to get started on some work despite my reservations at this time in the economy. Chatting with the dealer, he got me thinking if I shouldn't wait for a KX057, which is a bigger machine for about $13k more. I need to do some demo and digging work that I can't do with a skid steer. Can anyone give advice that's had experience with these 2 machines, or similar size machines, and the pros and cons. I've got a 14k dump trailer currently and would be moving the mini ex between 2 properties once in a while that are about 8 miles apart with a 3/4 ton. I accidentally overloaded the trailer to 21k pounds once while I was still figuring out weights and made the trip, so I'm not sure weight is the biggest concern because I can go slow on a usually vacant highway. What I'm trying to figure out is if I'm going to be regretting the smaller machine. My uses are: fixing some dams and putting in washed out overflows fixing building drainage installing culverts in creek crossings demo of small buildings cleaning up scrap metal (some heavy) possibly moving some 1300-1800 lb haybales moving pallets of feed & concrete in buildings cleaning up logging roads with new tree growth and downed trees digging water lines pounding drill stem on hills/sidehills where I can't get to it with a skid steer moving big limestone rocks (2x3x3 foot) hanging the odd deer and elk up Both properties are large, one is about 3 miles from end to end and there's about 900 acres of forest. Given, some work I want to do will require a full size excavator, so this is more to clean up around the buildings and old logging roads that have regrowth and downed trees and take care of stuff I wouldn't be hiring someone else to do and I can't get done with a skid steer. Plus some fencing that I can't do with a skid steer because it doesn't have the reach, clearing out chokecherry trees off the side of roads cut into steep hills, stuff like that. I'm currently sharing my skid steer with a business partner, but it's going to be mostly at his property and he's a PITA to deal with about it, so though I have access I'm trying not to use it much.
I have time in a kx040, a kx080 and a full size excavator. If I were buying a new mini I would probably want the 057 but to me its increased capacity isn’t worth $13k. I’d use that money for attachments, a bigger equipment trailer or such. My 2 cents.
I’ve run Kubota kx 040-4’s and kx 121-3’s extensively and have quite a few hours on Tak tb260 and some time on a Case cx57c. The biggest place I notice the difference is on land clearing and stumping. The extra reach and breakout force is noticeable on the 6 ton machines. Same for the lift capacity, loading heavy logs and stumps is easier with the larger machines. For ‘general’ use the difference isn’t as noticeable. Light clearing, grading, trenching, cleaning ditches, installing culverts, small demo etc is well within the capabilities of the kx040. The transportation issue is the reason why the kx040 is so popular. Its big enough to do some meaningful work but also legal to haul on a 14k trailer behind a 1-ton pickup. You’ll be way overloaded with a kx057 on your dump trailer behind a 3/4 ton, I personally wouldn’t do it even on back roads. FWIW I tow the 6-ton mini’s with a F700 and an 11 ton pintle hitch trailer and you can tell its back there.
The 121 is about a 9k machine, correct? So the tak tb260 is the most direct comparison to the Kubota 057? I just went by a dealer and spent some time poking around the 040 and 057. The 057 is notably larger, and what I noticed is the blade sticks out farther forward, so if you were working on a slope and needed to reach, the 057 seems like it would be much more stable. I didn't realize the kx 040 was so much more popular. I assume resale would be easier with it? I'm kind of giving thought to getting it, even though I think the 057 is a better fit for what I need, and getting a lot of the smaller work done, and if I run into problems then upgrade later. Interest rates are up. Privately one salesman that knew I wasn't going to buy from him said they have more inventory on the lot than they've had in a long time, which was of course obvious. But he also said a lot of his construction business is holding off due to the increase in interest rates slowing their business down. I smell deals coming, but I don't want to lose another summer to waiting for equipment prices to come down.
Yes the Tak tb260 is in the 6 ton class like the kx057. The kx121-3 and kx040-4 are basically the same machine, with some updates on the later. Open station, regular blade either weighs about, 9k. Add the cab, 6 way blade, steel under carriage, thumb, etc and the weight goes well over 10k. The kx040 is Kubota’s best selling model and if I’m not mistaken is the #1 selling mini ex of any brand, worldwide. That being said, the rule of thumb with excavators is buy the biggest one you can a) afford and b) haul.
I own three Takeuchi mini excavators, a 3,500 TB016, a 8,500lb TB240, and a 12,500 lb TB153FR. You should be able to do all that you need to do with the KX040 as long as it has a thumb. You need a 12" digging bucket, a 2' digging bucket, and a 3-4' wide clean out bucket. The bigger machine would be great. But, I wouldn't tow it with your rig. And even with the smaller machine it's wise to know the following. To tow a 14GVW trailer you are suppose to have a class A CDL. A dump trailer has a weight typically of 6000lbs. That means the most weight you can put in the trailer is 8000lbs. What is the towing capacity of your truck, as you will likely be at 17,000 lbs with full fuel, a few buckets, and some equipment (such as a diesel transfer tank) in the back of your truck? It's not just going up hill, but downhill. Everyone on this forum loves air brakes.
I'm not driving it to job sites, it would only be moved between properties once in a blue moon. So No fuel or extras, weight would be right at 15k lbs with the 040 or 17k lbs with the 057. Buckets could be hauled separately. No real hills to speak of between these properties. I may end up buying a trailer at some point because i need to haul materials in or logs out, but transport is only a very minor issue. If it was, i have a buddy with a one ton and equipment trailer, and a dump truck he tows his 10 ton excavator with. We're all on the rancher permit here and haul hay on 1960s 2-ton trucks. Been doing that since i was 15. I'm sure they could try to bust us all for not having cdls, but the only guys i know that have them drive semis. I'm not hiring out. Lots of inventory on the local lots right now compared to the past 2 years Looks like people are backing out of orders.
State laws vary. I have been told in California anything over 10,000 pounds needs a special license. Federally the GVWR of truck and trailer can not exceed 26,000 pounds unless you have a Class A license and all the stuff that goes with it (RV's fall into a different category). My 1997 dodge ton truck has a GVW of 10,500. I can haul a trailer of 15,500 pounds without a class A license but if the trailer had a 15,501 pound GVWR I would require a class A license. From Memory the 1998.5 to 2002 dodge ton trucks had a GVWR of 11,000 so they could only haul a 15,000 GVWR trailer without a class A license. The actual weight of the truck and trailer is irrelevant as it is a GVWR paperwork game not a reality based issue. That is why some guys prefer the older trucks and some choose a 3/4 ton over a ton truck. Just a FYI to consider.
Also take a look at the U48 and U55. You may not need a zero tail swing machine but they spec out in between the models you are looking at and are priced pretty competitively. One other thing to note is the KX057 and U55 are equipped with larger buckets than the smaller machines, might be important if you are doing any volume of excavating.
I think you'll be very happy with the smaller machine. And the smaller machine is still a serious size machine on any job site! I also do use on my TB240 with the buckets from my bigger TB153FR machine as MG84 suggest. However, you have to get what you want. A nice advantage of the bigger machine in your case is that the thumb will grasp larger items, like huge logs. But the bigger thumb may not grab the small stuff easily. Plenty of operators like to grab the twigs on the ground.
I thought it was federal law that said any trailer/equipment combo over 10,000 was class A cdl?
Federal law requirement is anything over 26,000 pounds GVWR needs a class A license. State laws vary. I have been told California requires a class A for anything over 10,000 pounds. What sucks is the newer 1/2 to 1 ton trucks have higher GVWR ratings which means they cannot tow as large a GVWR trailer as the older trucks legally could without a class A license.
What kind of 2-ton trucks do you have? If they are in decent shape they would probably be safer for hauling a 6-ton excavator than a 3/4 ton pickup and dump trailer. Either set one up with a pintle hitch and proper trailer or if they have a decent flat bed just haul it on the truck. Build a loading ramp at each property and away you go. Even an older F600 or C60 will easily haul 12000lbs.
I don't want to get this thread too far off topic, but which of the three is the most used? Most profitable? Best ROI?
Honestly I don't even know if they still have model numbers on them, lemme look. They're just old 2 tons that have flat beds on them that I use for hauling round bales. I've been cutting out use on them because they aren't well maintained anymore, and I started switching to hay hikers on the tractor. I had brakes fail on one going down a hill loaded full of hay. Worse comes to worse, I guess, I could hook the trailer up behind a tractor too, they get run back and forth between properties a few times a year. It would take me about an hour or so to make the short drive, but that's reasonable for as seldom as it happens. I'm way under that. Think you guys are in a much different situation than me. I don't see law enforcement in my area unless I call in a game warden, so what's legal isn't really an issue. I mean I regularly run cows down this road on an ATV. So the worry about brakes and getting into an accident is more of a worry of an animal bouncing off my grill guard than anything else. I'm sending the young ones out to pick up twigs Really I need the machine for things I can't lift, I'm not clearing areas where twigs matter, I'd be dealing with full size pine trees, or pulling out smaller trees. It might be more difficult with the small regrowth trees though.
In my opinion the extra weight, width, and most importantly the reach of the KX-057 is significant. When handling trees, brush etc. a larger machine also keeps the material further from the cab/operator (safer). We purchased a KX-040 new in 2017; at that time the KX-057 was $28k more (Canadian dollars)….so we went with the 040.
I use the TB240 the most. It does 90 percent of all the work I do. The big advantage of the bigger machine is that with the bigger thumb I can pick up some larger diameter logs and rocks. Not a weight issue, just bigger grip. Also, if I have to load my bigger dump truck, it can reach up and over better. The TB153FR boom design is also helpful. But for just digging, loading, and using the thumb, the TB240 is just fine. Comes down to money. If you have the money, go bigger. But the big machine can sometimes be just a bit big (like, so to lift up that elk you need a 12,000 lb machine? Something my wife would say). I also like how the TB240 (and smaller machines) performs in its speed, smoothness, and finesse.
The only times you will regret the bigger machine is when you buy it and when you haul it.
One of my favorite sayings for situations such as this. "A lot can always do a little, but a little can never do a lot."
and when you pay for repairs on the bigger machine with the bigger more expensive parts. If federal rules did not limit the size of machine that can be hauled without a special license and paperwork many people would want a 6-7 ton machine.
The cost of the more expensive parts between the two machines of this sizes would hardly be noticed. Assuming even that you would ever need to replace them. Also remember the increase work capacity of the larger machine. Your getting more done, so whatever the cost increases may be on replacing parts, your payback is the increase in capacity and performance.
This is a good point. Time is already short for me. I find it a little strange Kubota hasn't put a 6 way blade on the 057. How useful is the 6 way over the 4 way that comes with the 057?
As far as I am concerned the blade on a excavator is there to stabilize the machine when digging, with a little bonus of helping out with backfilling sometimes. A 6 way blade on an excavator is mostly sales gimmickry.
I would not agree that bigger is always better. Don't get me wrong, I love my Takeuchi TB153FR 6.5 ton machine. But if bigger is always better, why would all the brands make so many sizes of mini excavators? Mountain Rancher could for sure go with a 6-9 ton machine and be very, very happy with it. For me, I use the bigger machine for some of the following work: 1. Lift heavy pre-casted concrete items like catch basins and lamp post base 2. Lift and move rocks in the large 3 man size to small 4 man size 3. Load logs that are 3-4' dia round 4. Use my pallet forks to pick up heavy pallets 5. Use the extended reach to load my tall sided dump truck 6. Use a tall wide 3' dia Auger 7. Pull out large stumps, although I no longer try and pull out anything over a couple of feet in dia. Here are some of the disadvantages I have of the TB153FR over the TB240: 1. The extra 10hp engine can burn 5 gallons more fuel a day if running at full throttle. Figure 15ga 2. The bigger machine is noisy. If I'm just loading a pile of dirt (using the TB240 machine with the TB153Fr buckets, I may have the throttle midway. The TB240 is much quieter, and will sip fuel and be just as fast). And I can have the radio on! 3. Putting the tracks back on the bigger machine can be a two man job 4. Greasing the bigger stick is harder to reach 5. With the big machine I need to chain up with bigger chains, and with chain binders. The smaller machine at times can be loaded with just large ratchet straps. 6. My TB153FR machine is towed on a big Trailmax tilt trailer behind a Kenworth T800 dump truck. My smaller machine is towed on 14GVW car trailer with International 4900 and sometimes my pick Up. 7. Operating the bigger machine near trees and buildings, sometime the tall stick is in the branches or the eves etc. 8. Cost is a bit more for fuel, insurance, buying new tracks, sprockets, pins and bushings, buckets, etc 9. The extra weight of the bigger machine can crack and even sink a concrete and asphalt driveway, and crush the water line, irrigation, septic field pipes, and leave ruts in the lawn. Lastly, not all 6 ton mini's have great spec. There are some 5 ton mini's that have almost the same spec. And a lot of performance is the operators skills and know how. Homeowners and general Contractors are often surprised with what I can do with just my TB016 3,500 lb mini excavator.
The difference as I see it Peter is this is a homeowner, that is buying one machine. So no matter what the job is it must be done with that machine. So if your only machine is on the small size, you either rent a bigger one or hire it out jobs that the machine cant do. Spend the money up front and buy a bigger machine, in this case one size bigger you are more likely covered. As I said in my quote, bigger can always do smaller. Sometimes bigger is more than you need, but better to have and not need, then to need and not have. You have multiple options for chosing the right excavator. I have two options 6.5T and 20T. They are not always the perfect size, but I make it work. This homeowner has one choice, he should chose the machine that gives him the most options without being ridiculous. There are many different sizes because many times buyers know the kind of excavation that they will be doing with their machine. Transportation rules are the reason that the 35 sized machines are the most popular mini. Not because its the right size, but rather the right weight first of all.
Agreed, and a VERY expensive option at that. I personally prefer the standard blade, it’s tucked in closer to the machine and therefore gives more useable reach when digging over the blade. If you have to backfill in a tight area use the bucket.
He asked for the Pro's and con's, which is what I've tried to do. We don't know exactly what the homeowner is going to do with his machine, his skill level, his budget, his terrain, whether he will service the machine himself and has a shop to service it in, and what his significant other may thinks about all this. YES, I THINK HE SHOULD GET THE BIGGER MACHINE IF THAT IS IN HIS BUDGET. But the KX-040 is still a serious machine, and quite big machine for a homeowner with just a dump trailer. For all we know, a 6 ton machine may be way too small if he wants to build some roads and he should look for a nice used Deere 160 with push blade and steel tracks.
I purchased a KX040-4 w/ 6-way blade, premium cab, dual aux. hydraulics and thumb with 296hrs from a private seller about 4 wks ago. I was trying to find a KX057 with low hrs but was unable to find one in my budget. I couldn't be happier with my 040 purchase. I have put 100 hrs on it clearing ash, large cedar, deadfall, thick vines and honeysuckle on my forest farm and have built an access road up rocky sloping terrain. Included in the purchase was 12" and 24" tooth buckets and a 36" grading bucket. So far I've selectively cleared 20 acres of dense forest. I occasionally find a stump with a deep tap root the requires a bit of time digging and prying, but for the most part, the 040 has quickly removed most stumps. In retrospect, I wouldn't want anything bigger to maneuver around and between trees (I'm not clear cutting, just selectively removing less desirable and invasives to open the forest floor to some light). The 6-way blade is a luxury I don't "need" but has proven very useful cutting an angled-wall culvert next to my road and leveling up the 040 on uneven terrain providing a rock-solid platform for digging, prying, lifting and pushing over trees. I've placed a boulder wall for erosion control next to the creek, loaded logs on my trailer, stripped branches from the logs (don't have to limb with a saw), and operated a rock hammer attachment for fast and effective rock removal. I know the 057 would be even more productive but in retrospect, the 040 is about all want my 3/4 ton truck with a bed of tools pulling a 16K trailer loaded with three buckets to deal with. I was able to pull it through the mountains from Asheville, NC and eastern KY, cruise control set, and it never varied from it's assign speed. I know that wouldn't be so with the 057 and I'd hate to think of what it would do to my 3/4 ton's engine, transmission and rear end over time. The one thing I really really wish my 040 had is a longer reach. Just 1ft would be a noticeable difference. Other than wishing for the longer stick option, I have absolutely NO regrets, and that has been a real surprise. Good luck with your purchase!
Thanks, this is great info. I think 2 machines eventually will be the right solution. I have a ton of work to do, about 1000 acres of legit mountain forest in the rockies and another 5000 of other ground to maintain and build on (homesteading, installing fence, water development, culverts and crossings, etc). it's not fresh ground, but a lot of it was built or last maintained 50-150 years ago. I'll probably have to get a logger back in at some point, but for now I want to clean up the areas around the roads that are no longer passable with a pickup. Also great info. Thank you. I think the problem I run into is trying to find one solution for good, rather than think about a solution that can change. Machines can always be traded or sold. The bigger machine can definitely handle more jobs, and the jobs I do more efficiently. Only negative may be getting down some tight roads cut on hillsides to get to ponds for maintenance. That and working in tight timber. There's only so much I can do though on steep grades. I'm going to have to contract out for some of it. 2 machines is probably the right option. I do have some serious terrain to manage (see above). I'm going to have to level up my skills before tackling a lot of it. I've been shying away from used equipment because I don't have a ton of experience operating a mini-ex, maybe 50-70 hours, and I'm looking for dealer cooperation if something breaks. But when I go big I'll do that. If the Deere 160 is a good machine I'll start researching them now, and maybe will be ready to buy one in 5-10 years. The dump trailer is more for hauling out old buildings to the burn pits and some material to crossings. I've got a buddy with a dump truck if I need to move a lot of material. Thanks, excellent info! That's pretty much the identical machine that's on my dealer's lot. I see some guys running a 48" clean up bucket on the 040. What's your opinion on the 36"? Are you using a frost ripper to cut roots, or has the bucket been sufficient?
I haven't used the 36" bucket yet so can't offer any feedback. I use both the 24" or the 12" for roots but tend to leave the 24" bucket on most of the time. I'd love to have a ripper but don't want to be switching out too often. Technique is important and, while I'm green as hell at this, I find large roots can be broken out curling the teeth on top of the root, breaking it in one or two attempts as opposed to curling under them and trying to pry upwards. I start near the stump and sometimes get lucky but usually work my way out from the stump before I can break the largest of the roots.
I opted for the 42" bucket on the JD 35G. It does grade things out a bit faster and you can bulk move more loose material, but a full bucket of wet heavy will have you on your toes. It would be similar if not more pronounced with a 48" on a 40. It would depend on the depth of the bucket. If they offered a 42" I'd go that way, but if not the 48" would tempt me. The 36" is too small for a 40 IMO.
Some have asked what I paid for the ex so I'll post it to the thread. From a private seller posted on MachineryTrader, $60K for the 2019 KX040-4, 296hrs., premium cab w/ ac and heat, multi-adjustable suspension seat, halogen cab and boom-mounted lights, auto idle w/ eco mode, 6-way blade, 2 auxiliary ports, thumb, quick attach coupler, 12" and 24" tooth buckets, 36" grading bucket (all Kubota OEM). I didn't have to pay sales tax, which saved me several thousand more dollars. This configuration with all options and buckets currently prices out around $96K MSRP in the Kubota online configurator, not including tax. But I have his original invoice and know he paid a pre-COVID $74K plus taxes in 2019. Dealers in the the southeast were asking in the ~$65-70k range for 1500hr cab machines, ~$60K for <1000 hrs canopy machines.
I do use a 48" bucket on my Takeuchi TB240 for grading and digging. I sometimes even put the 6 ton TAG 48" wide bucket on which is a bit bigger. Works great! I do find that stump removal regarding anything bigger than around 1-2' in dia is harsh on the machine. I've had experience blowing hydraulic hoses, teeth falling off, and pins breaking. Mostly on older machines though. Now I try and do it only if one stump is really in the way. And I take my time and be gentle. Looks like Paul got a very good deal. I do wonder why people by new only to put a few hundred hours on it and then sell it off after their project is done. Why not just buy a $35,000 used machine, put a few hundred hours on it and then try and sell it off for what they paid for it or even for a bit more.
Just curious. Do you ever swap the bucket pins from speed/max travel location to max power location?
I don't, no. Tried it once many years ago though. The machine has a Wain Roy style quick connect and I'm always changing buckets and attachments. I have a 12". 18", 24", 48" buckets, ripper tooth, pallet forks, and a breaker.
For many people that don't use them professionally, having a new machine with a warranty so it works when you need it and is worth the time and piece of mind. Buying an older piece of equipment and not knowing if it will start or run when you need it, especially when you're far away from a dealer and need it on the weekends or sometimes at night, pays you back over time. Do you have a decent set of pallet forks to recommend?
On that note, our 1998 JD120 has started and ran every time I needed it for 20 years, with the exception of draining some water from a filter or replacing the batteries one time a long time ago. (knocks on wood). It has not led an easy life with regards to care. While I was gone from '11 to '20, it had no service what-so-ever. It was criminal.
Yeah I have one takeuchi with that same coupler, 12, 18, 24 and 36" buckets, no pallet forks, ripper or breaker though . I've only swapped bucket pivot pin twice in 3 years on it. My other takeuchi has WB coupler but still has the double pin locations. I've found I miss the extra articulation of the bucket when in the power position more than I appreciate the extra break out force.
Yeah, I always need the articulation. The pallet forks I have, I custom built. Work well, but on this size machine the lift up weight is minimal, while the lift and lower is pretty good. (Example lift pallet load of 800 lbs up into back of truck, lower a pallet load of 1500lbs below grade over the blade). Pallet forks work better on my 6 ton machine, and would be best on a 9 ton machine to move around 3000lb pallets of hardscape materials. For those wanting to make pallet forks, see prior thread on this site.