I have been a Chevy guy my whole life and having friends on the repair and paint/body business, I have Dodge as bottom barrel in terms of quality anything but they use a Cummins! I have been borrowing 3/4 and 1T 4 tire trucks. I need to pull a gooseneck with authority. I like the idea of a dually BUT I would drive it 90% of the time unloaded and economy is VERY important to me. If that was a non-issue, I would just get a Chevy with a Dmax and be done. Here are some basics I need: Ability to Gross 35-40K if needed but likely would not much exceed 30K. 4x4 Diesel Prefer auto trans (bullet proof) at least extended cab but prefer 4 door (king cab, crew cab, etc) USED! I am a man on budget so I will be searching for a rebuilder or used truck with over 100K. My current truck has 205K and runs like a top. Other had 315K but was tired. I have seen some ridiculous claims on mileage so lets keep it honest. Your Dmax does NOT get 30MPG loaded. Buddy of mine just used one and claims were that it got 17MPG with 8K behind it. It got 6-8MPG at a total gross of 26K truck/trailer comb. I want to consider the economy, prices of trucks, and the reliability of certain power plants and trannies. I know Ford had some sucky ones in the 7.3s. My dad has run duallies for 30yrs. 2 different 7.3 trucks with auto. about 4 trannies in each.... NOPE! He went to a manual with 7.3 and loved it but there are times I kind of need an auto. He LOVED his Dodge with 6.7L!
If you're grossing 30-40K then you really need at least a medium duty truck.
I would not do that other than to move a piece of equipment locally. Over the road, not over 30K. I am also putting up total gross numbers for truck and trailer. Trucks will probably be about 9000.
Diesels are so messed up right now with the emissions BS. Even the Cummins.
Yep, that BS will be the first to go. We could not even drive a 3/4 out of town recently because it is all plugged up from the EGR BS. IIRC, the 6.7 cummins has a cat and regen modes but does not have the urea injection? Dad's newest Ford with 6.9? does have it. He hates the truck.
From what you list as your needs, it sounds like you'd be better off shopping for 2 trucks: an older medium duty 2wd for when you need to gross 30k+ and a then a 3/4 ton for your regular driving.
Overall I'm not real happy with my duramax. Its a long story, but I have had a few problems with it and GM refuses to cover any of it because of what they say are signs of abuse from the previous owner. Aside from that, I bought it thinking I would use it to move my hoe, since next year most of the big trucks around here will be off the road due to emissions. Well I only made two trips with the backhoe before I decided it was a bad idea. I live in a mountain community with no flat driving which doesn't help any, if I lived and worked in the valley it might be a different story. But in my area grossing 30-35k the motor overheats going uphill & the transmission and brakes overheat going down hill, all while getting about 5mpg. If I had to make a emergency stop at that weigh going downhill it would get ugly in a hurry. Empty, or as empty as I get with same light tools and extra fuel I average 13-13.5 mpg, I have got as good as 15mpg empty on the highway. Some say this is horrible, but I wonder if those same people dont know how to use a calculator. When I consider my last truck (Dakota 4.7L) got a solid 11mpg and weighed 2k pounds less, I think its pretty good. I agree with others above, to gross 30k you want at least a medium duty.
I appreciate the replies but if possible, I would like to stay on topic of trucks, not the decision of buying a bigger one. We are also looking to buy a semi later to run heavier loads but I still have plenty I need to do with a gooseneck to justify the purchase. So far it sure seems that the old 5.9 Cummins is the engine to beat in terms of reliability and MPG. However, I am not sure I would want to buy a truck that old since it looks like the 2000-2003 trucks are the ones to consider. ? Something about rail pressures went up and injectors were prone to failure which then nuked pistons. It also seems that the newer 6.7 trucks are good. However, I would hate to step away from Chevy just to get the exact same mileage. I keep reading where people get 25+ MPG.... Hell, I can lie too, I get 32MPG with my gasser. When you get down below 10MPG, even 1 MPG on a trip can really affect the pocket book. ALso, when considering a load, without knowing what the load is and what it weighs, it is all a guess. Some people just put the blanket "with load" in there. Gotta have more details.
The ultimate solution here would be to find an F450/F550 super duty with a bagged 6.0 or 7.3 and also find a pre-4 valve 5.9 cummins dodge truck. Put the 5.9 into the Ford. Then you'll have a truck.
I feel your asking a lot from a one ton 30-40k even local is stupid, great fuel mileage, and no hassle with problems. All trucks have their own strong points and weak links. Do research on what you like and figure out what problems you might be willing to deal with. No truck is perfect, I'm a ford man, if i went to buy a new work truck, wouldnt hesitate to get a new f350 with a 6.7 Have two early ones at work now with over 100,000 miles and no issues at all. Both those trucks weigh in around 11,000 pounds daily. and get 15-18 mpg. And tow damn good. Dodges have issues, chevys have issues and fords have had issues.
A daily driver to haul 40K?? No thanks. Either buy a hotshot truck, which will get you to 26k or buy a 6 wheeled class 8 and get a trailer to go behind it. I would either use a dump truck and trailer or lowboy for this application. Good Luck, CD
Problem here is in our wonderful state next year we are all limited to trucks with a DPF systems. So you cant buy a cheap well used truck. My point was that since my pickup will not be grossing 30k like I originally intended a 3/4 ton would have been adequate. Also you mentioned fuel usage being a concern, a med duty and heavy duty truck will use less fuel @ 30-40k in my experience.
Not a option down here in commi-fornia. But why would you replace a 7.3 with a 12 valve? That doesn't really seem like a step up to me....... Now maybe cramming a 8.3 cummins in there.
If you want to pick up a truck to fix and make reliable I would find a 06-07 f-350 with a poor running 6.0. I know guys that bought these trucks new and hated how much time and money they had to put in the motor to make them reliable. IMO once you remove or replace the weak components on a 6.0 you have one of the best running diesels around. I cann't help you on the mileage because we don't pay attention to how many miles we are getting between tank fulls.
That would be my suggestion as well, although how can you delete the EGR, etc and still be legal in Cali? My '13 F350 with 6.7 gets 17 average around town and 11 pulling a T250 or mini-ex. Typical loaded weight of my truck without trailer is around 10K lbs with fuel tank, tool box and all the crap I carry in the back.
That sounds really good to me! Is this a single wheel 1 ton? If was buying a new pickup now I think I would go Ford.
Fastline - I've got an 08 F450 and it gets 7.6 mpg loaded or unloaded, wide open or piddling along. So I guess I'm saying if you're looking for mpg's, stay away from a 6.4 F450. Lol Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
Single wheel 1 ton, running 18" tires. No mods, just stock.
Is there a production truck that matches the criteria listed? My personal setup is a 2001 4.6 ton Mercedes Sprinter van as my daily driver. It gets 22 mpg average and that includes towing a 3.5 ton trailer about half the time. It only has 130 hp, but with a resistor on the fuel rail sensor it has a little more grunt that stock. I went with a van so I wouldn't have to worry about tools getting stolen out of the back of my truck or getting wet in the rain. I have a 19 ton roll-off truck to do my heavy lifting. Between the two vehicles, I have about $20k invested. I'd love to have another pickup truck as my daily driver, but there just isn't the ROI and its a luxury that I can't afford at the moment. With that said and budget aside, Dodge says they have a truck for you: http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2013-ram-2500-3500-hd-pickup-first-drive-review If you go the older used truck route, shop for something with the biggest diameter factory wheels that you can find. You'll need the large diameter brake discs.
Yair . . . I saw one of the new Dodges the other day and they look uglier in real life than they do in the pictures . . . strange, a few models back the Ram looked one tough truck. To my eye it's something with the grille. As with most things I suppose it could grow on you. I wonder why they went with the complexity of a v6 three litre engine . . . is it just the US market doesn't like the straight four and five cylinder configuration? Cheers.
I love my pick up but, When me and the wife get our camper we will see. I plan on test running the new diesel pick ups. Will see how they play out. Ultimately I am going to go with a 650 crew cab with a cummins. I don't do a daily commute as I have a company truck so this will be my weekender as well. I have seen too many accidents with guys on 4 wheels that though they were 18. People are not bullet proof and their is a reason for a medium duty truck market.
Yeah Joispoi, my brother has a dually sprinter and loves it. I have pumped the diesel and worked the calculator myself and seen mileage in the 20s. They make a chassis cab version, but over here they are rarer than hens teeth. If you would UPS me a used one, I'd put my own bed on it.
Just send me a box full of stamps....I'll mail mine to you when I'm done with it.
In CARB Land, recently Nov-ish 2013, there was a change to allow 5000 miles annually instead of 1000 miles annually for the next 5 years (re: Low Use). Also there is the proviso for designated category CT (Construction Truck). Maybe this could help? * I was advised a long time ago to face the music eg get a medium duty truck, and: enroll in BIT(DOT), motor carrier permit, yard/storage rental, Class A license and random testing, special insurance, etc. The amount of money & effort spent on all this allowed me to learn what the single axle DT466 Dump gets done .... time proved it was way wiser than trying to do this with either the one ton and/or heavy duty one ton rigs....and I compare this to the experiences of some of my friends and associates who tried the one truck idea. I have an older technology work 3/4t Pickup and the Dump. We talk about getting a tilt trailer for the pickup but the dump truck can easily haul 6 ton. So I have yet to do it. What I will do when the Regulator's hammer falls on my rig will be addressed then: but with the 2014 price out the door of a 4 tire 4wd Ford 350 Lariat bigger cab at $71k, it will probably be another medium duty....or the lottery & retire! LOL Could you get a late model medium duty or do you have to make one truck do the job? ***** As to emissions stuff, the complexity is becoming undaunting. The modern medium duty engines in the 200 HP or so, use SCR, EGR, DOC/DPF, hi pressure injectors, multi faceted turbo gizmos, computer and recorders....will be glad the thing will run when I have to own one. ***** The work opportunities for the last five years doesn't involve much of the yellow equipment these days due to specifics of economy. So we keep plodding along, or should I say clinging?
I've owned and towed with F-350 SRW, F-350 DRW and F-550 DRW. Blown a total of 5 transmissions in the two that were automatics. The E4OD and 4R100 transmissions found on the 7.3 powered Fords are not strong by any means. You can get them built up to be reliable for just under $5000. As far as towing goes, I've done close to 30,000 gross with the F350 SRW but it was a white knuckle ride each and every time for the duration. The trailer will toss around the truck and all moves must be planned well in advance. For some reason when you add duals at the rear all that goes away and it's a pleasure to drive.You need only to plan your stopping ahead of time. The F350 DRW and 550 both excel at towing heavy loads. The ideal truck would be a Super Duty dually with a transplanted Cummins, it shouldn't be too hard to find a 6.0 version with a toasted engine.
I realize that you not Dodge fan but here are some real world MPG numbers from my own experience. I have a 2006 D3500 dually with a 5.9 and automatic transmission. Not really relevant to this conversation but it also has a factory jake brake on it. The longest loaded trip i have taken with this truck was two years ago when I went from Merkel Tx to Bellows Falls Vermont, a round trip distance of right at 4000 miles. My truck was loaded to the max that I ever load it going over the scales at 25.5K. I ran the speed limit all the way not pressing the truck. The trailer is a 22' tandem utility goosneck rated for 14K. The load consisted of a L170 skidsteer, several implements, and other tools needed of the job. My average fuel mileage for the two way trip was 11mpg. This was calculated mileage, not the lie-o-meter (lie-o-meter indicated 13mpg). I was pretty happy with that. At the time this trip was taken the truck had about 105K on it. I had purchased it new in '06. This truck seems to get about 18mpg running around empty (again calculated mileage). My previous truck was a 96 D3500 with a 5.9 12V and 5spd transmission. Loaded it would get about 8mpg and empty it would get as much as 22mpg. Operationally the difference between the trucks is that the newer one has a lot more power at 325hp/600ftlbs than the old one at 215hp/400ftlbs. You can really tell the difference pulling the hills. I really like the automatic transmission and don't think I would ever go back to a standard. Hope this is helpful, Tim
I have heard that a lot. My god daughters husband always keeps an extra 5.9 just in case as she drive a super duty.
That's real world numbers for my F350 with 6.7 as well, 11 towing and 18 hwy. Those numbers were close with my '06 350 with 6.0, the towing was 11 and hwy was 16. I think you will find these numbers to be realistic for most of the modern diesel pickups. I don't believe the 22 mpg pulling 10K lbs testimonies.
We have three Dodge 2500s with the 6.7 cummins and we haven't had any problems with them. They don't get the best mileage in the winter because they typically idle most of the day when it's below 0. They idle most of the day and we still have not had problems with the DPF or EGR systems as long as you use the cruise control to keep them idled up. All of them have around 100,000 miles on them. During the summer, one of the supervisors was getting about 17 with his on the highway. We also have a 2006 Chevy Duramax one ton with 180,000 miles on it with out any major problems at all. It is used strictly for pulling a 30' 5th wheel, hauling stuff across state lines for Ziegler Cat and RDO Equipment. Our mechanic bought a brand new 6.7 Powerstroke for a personal pickup, and already had to replace the engine. Just my 2 cents
I also have a '12 f350 6.7 dually with a 4.10 rear and a flatbed dump weighing in around 10500 . I average 15mpg...loaded with trailer and mini or skidsteer, I get 13 mpg. If you are looking for an older used diesel go with a a cummins. They are rugged, they are loud and they have some serious pull . they also get pretty good fuel economy. I use to run a 96 or 98 1 ton dually dodge 4 speed w/4.10 rears and it was a tough truck. As owners of 1 ton or 3/4 ton diesel trucks, we need to realize that 15 mpg is pretty good, for the most part we need to come to grips with the fact that we are probably never going to get 22 mpg....These are work trucks not compact sedans. The funny part, is that I also own an all wheel drive subaru for my family rig and it gets 24 mpg at best....can we ever win!???
Any year of Dmax with the late 07s-09s getting the worse mileage. Which can be fixed with tuners. Any year of Ford that doesn't have a 6.4 and IMO the 6.7 isn't that great nether. I know there are guys having good luck with them, but I don't know that its the norm. If you get a 6.0 delete the EGR and put head studs in it. Dodge never had a decent truck or a good trans, but hey its got a cummins. A trans can be built. Anything newer then 06+ 5.9 need to have emission stuff removed. If you are really going to haul that kind of weight get a engine brake. Aftermarket or Dodge had them after 06 and any late 04+ Dmax can have one tuned into it or has one stock. Removing emissions equipment is getting harder and harder. The EPA has REALLY cracked down on tuners. Some make damn sure you can do what you think your going to do. CA also has emission testing for diesel so think about that before you go crazy with aftermarket. But I do know of guys making 800+ HP that pass emissions in there Dmaxs. My vote is a 06-early 07 Dmax very reliable. Its the newest truck you can get that will do what you want and not need much if any help from the aftermarket. You will pay a premium for this generation of Dmax for that reason.
To reply to the original question the solution I came up with was run an f-550 to haul the lighter loads anything under 20000 lbs and have a cheap toyota tacoma to run around getting parts and doing bids. Came out the cheapest for me seeing how it is not uncommon for me to put 300 miles in in a day. As far as fuel milage the best I have seen my 550 do is 15 mpg no load under perfect conditions normally under load it is 7-10 mpg.
to answer the question about the EGR delete kit for the ford 6.0l and still be "legal" remove the stock cooler, weld both ends up solid, leak test it, and then reinstall it. don't mean to ruffle feathers, but I would move out of California, and then purchase a truck that would actually function. I own 2006 ford 6.0l and a 2007 ford 6.0l and hate to think about what I will have to replace them with. they have been very dependable, but are a pain the rear to work on. and when they break, it costs big money. nothing is simple anymore.