Just Bought This New Excavator From Sany Sy230 Got A Smoken Good Deal On It 2007 For 125,000 New Nice Excavator With Cummins Power
Looks like a nice machine and a good price. Who makes this type of machine?
I bought it from cc equipmentsales in richmond canada
It is Chinese. I saw their booth at Conexpo. Everything looked like reverse engineered cat, especially their dozer. Not that is bad but thats what it looked like.
That’s the first Sany excavator I have seen around here. What kind of work do you do?
Hey sanyguy did you really buy this to use, or are you pushing this to sell.:beatsme
Flip the 3 and the 2 in its model and that is what I operate. Looks about the same weight. Nice lookin' :cool2 impressing some chicks I suppose?
Yes,Sany is a fomous brand in china,we used to have connection with them. :beatsme www.china-tractors.com/content/82/944.htm
Look My Excavator Local license made Deutz water-cooled diesel engine or Japanese made Yanmar diesel engine Rexroth hydraulic pumps,values,swing and travel hydraulic motors made in Germany swing and travel hydraulic motors,Italian made axles and transmission Luxurious cabin with air conditioner
looks like a cheap crap, Luxurious cabin what if your 6 foot 4 im not sold sales man!
nice excavator mate i am looking for a cheap excavator from asutealia so i can make some money out of it.
Hopefully another UK based member will chip in with a name, I cannot remember it :Banghead ( doesn't really matter anyway ) but a long time plenty experience UK plant man has set up an import / dealer supply for these machines and is convinced of a market place here for them. Last I saw he was bringing in 3 sizes and had a stock holding of spares. With the intention of increasing the range in a year. A few years back my govner of the day bought a brand new 360LCH Halla, he went on to buy another and after a few days asked my opinion. It was used for bulk loading ADT's Man could that machine dig, had a/c, half decent radio, decent size cab, what more could a pilot desire. My only comment was, what will it be like in 2-3 yrs? Can you afford to throw it away, will it have paid for itself ? Same goes for the above mentioned. You pays your money and you takes your chance :beatsme Dont expect it to last a lifetime or be worth more than you paid for it in 2 yrs :thumbsup
I have never herd of that brand before....wierd! Cool but wierd.
looks a nice bit of kit just the right size for me ! if you buy another one ill come over from the uk and drive it for you !
what does it weigh? hp? etc... who sells parts
it weighs 23 ton but ccequipmentsales has sizes from 200 to 420 excavators and have a full parts warehouse in richmond b c check out there web site www.ccequipmentsales.com Max.digging height 9380mm/30'9.3' Max.dumping height 6515mm/21'4.4' Max.digging depth 6920mm/22'8.4' Max.vertical wall digging depth 6010mm/19'8.6'' Max.digging reach 10180mm/33'4.8' Min.swing radius 3860mm/12'8'' Operating weight 22900kg/50706 lb Rated power 142/2200kW/rpm/190.4/2200hp/rpm
heres some new pics of the sany 230 working
so which one is yours? the first pics or the work pics?
I think both
another job site sany 230 working
I seen a sany, not mine, but seems good. I got a Halla HE50 A or something like that near me. Wanna buy, it, it does nothing, unless you count sitting as doing something. Will post pics.
Hate to dig up an old post, but figured i would throw in my input on these machines. I had to chance to jump on the 210 model at the forestry demo show here in Nova Scotia over the weekend. I was just chatting with the sales person at their booth and he asked me if i wanted to try it out, ofcourse, who would pass up an opertunity to try a new machine. I jumped in the cab and had trouble starting the engine, turns out i had to wait a minuite for all this computer mumbo-jumbo to dile itself in (im use to running the old cat 2 series machines, with no comp diagnostics etc..) I was suprised as to how smooth the machine was, the hydraulics had alot of power and the cummins sounded great ofcourse. To sum it up, i was quite impressed for the half hour i was running the machine, but then again, it was only a half hour, could be different after 1000 hours... Lots of power and very smooth and operator friendly. Ive been lurking around here for awhile, figured i would make my first post. great forum -Ben
Welcome to Heavy Equipment Forums Snooker! :drinkup
I hate to be bitter but I hate seeing these china machines comin in. More power to anyone who will buy one, but dont cry to you local cat, deere, volvo etc.. dealer when it wears out in a 1000 hours and they wont give ya a good trade in on a good machine. Having a cummins is cool but thats just the engine. Buy local and support you local dealers try to keep the money in this country cuz god knows we need it. Just my 2 cents!!!:usa
I am working for a company in Papua New Guinea at the moment, and we have just placed an order for some equipment made by Sany. Cranes, excavators, concrete pumps, and a roller. We went to China and had a look in the factories and were impressed enough to decide to purchase. The factories were not like the stereotype you would expect - they were clean, well lit, well organised, had good tooling, CNC machining etc. They even had testing and R&D sections. The main components are imported known brands, depending on which machine, you get Cummins, Isuzu, Mitsubishi, or Deutz engines, Kawazaki and Rexroth hydraulics, Robway load cells etc. The models and serial numbers are recognised by these companies for supply of parts. Engines that are Teir 3 emission complient can be supplied if required. The undercarriage is Chinese, but we are told that it is the same as Komatsu, so sourcing aftermarket replacements should be easy. Of course it is a gamble on the quality of the steel in the Chinese components as to how fast it wears out, but you have to bear in mind that the purchase price is a lot lower than any of their competitors. The main consideration for us is that we are about to begin a big construction project here, and need the machines supplied soon. Place an order for a new European crane, and you have to wait at least 2 years. Sany can supply one in about 3 months.
Back some years now my brother was running a Nissan dealership (and anything else petrol or diesel powered) up from Rabaul. I worked over at Bouganville and then running fuel up the fly river. The name of the game in New Guinea was support yourself....didn't matter what brand you had...conditions where atrocious and support was non-existent....getting and keeping fuel clean was one of the biggest problems. Good Luck with the job...and Welcome to the Heavy Equipment Forums
This is probably straying away from the thread a little, but what is it that you are doing down in Papua New Guinea? Where have your operators come from, local or Ausi?
The sany sort of reminds me of a samsung, cheap to buy, great at first, and then by hour 6000 its time to sell it because its going to get slow and very expensive. But hey, I hope I'm wrong, it would be interesting to have another dog in the field, but I'm not much of a betting man.
Bellboy, Whilst I am just on a short term contract with the company, they are PNG owned and operated, and have been for about 30 years. All of the operators are PNG nationals with just a few Australian and New Zealand project managers. The company is mainly involved with marine construction projects, wharves, jettys, navigational aids, piling, also bridges and road works.
Squizzy, Yes we are well aware about the atrocious condtions and non-existent support in PNG. When you try to tell other people back home about it, you can tell they don't believe you. Improvisation is about the most useful thing you have. Thanks for the welcome.
if they're using cummins engines, kawasaki pumps, shouldn't be any different than what most of us run here now.
The samsung is a very light duty machine, and also uses among other things ticket items like a cummins engine to try and sell it. In the big picture, there's a lot more to a good machine. When a machine like the samsung is used in more serious applications like mountainous road building or a forestry application they will literally start falling apart in the hands of the operator after about 7,000hours. When I was fixing heavy equipment there for a living I had a few customers with these cheaper machines and I used to joke that they were my retirement plan
I have seen an old samsung operating, and it is not the most joyful moment of my life so far. It's hydraulics were weak, its cab was shot, and the machine was just generally slow. It had about 6000 or more hours on the clock, the cab was open when it was not operating, and some one had decided they liked the panelling in the cab. It was a backyard done high cab jobbie, so maybe thats where the problem lies.
samsung =volvo I have operated volvos samsungs doosans etc and have grumbled about them but When you compare the inital purchase price it is possible to have 1 1/2 of the above compared to a equal Cat, change them after 6500 hrs get a new one with warranty and drive it like you stole it.
Get a new cat or the same original brand?
Really when it's all said and done , if you can get 6000-7000 hours out of a $125,000 digger you can throw it away and it will owe you nothing . 3 of these machines bought in succession will owe you $375,000 and at the above rate will last a combined 21,000 hours without even replacing tracks . How much would a Cat etc at a similar singular purchase cost owe you in repairs and what will it's value be at 21,000 hours ?
Iron Horse Thats one outlook, and for some it will work. If you are the sole user, and costly job deadlines are not your bag, that approach may work. I say this because in getting to that 6,000 hr mark, there are likely to many problems, small and not so small, that will have you down and looking for parts. If this is an acceptable trade off for the low purchase price, great. If, on the other hand, you do a lot of high production work with tight deadlines, you will be in trouble when the machine is down and the whole job grinds to a halt waiting on service. The loss of money from downtime could be enough reason to buy a proven performer. In the typical work I perform, I want a proven performer, and one with a ready supply of parts and service to get it running again fast. I just sold a Cat 330BL with around 8000 hrs on the meter, and in the 7 years I owned it, the worst that happened was a few blown hoses and o-rings, as well as replacing pins and bushings in the bucket linkage. Oh, and 1 Hyd oil cooler when the side got bashed in by the so called "operator'. I also have Cat 350L with 15,000 on the meter, and other than hoses and bushings, only a rebuilt hydraulic pump for repairs. I seriously doubt you will be able to say that with one of these. As for me, I would buy a used Cat before I would buy a new Chinese machine if the purchase price was a concern. (and it is) That said, they will surely improve over time, or they will cease to exist. The price will come up as they do also.
As of late , there has been a flood of imported 500 hour Kobelco , Komatsu and Hitachi diggers on the Aussie market for around $140K . In all honesty , if i was looking for another digger i would buy one of these even though i like to buy NEW . I too like the name brand machines as they got to be name brand machines for a reason . But i think a new Chinese machine with full warranty changed over at 3000 hours is also good value . When you consider the amount you will claim as depreciation on your tax because you leased a new bit of gear and the $450K gross earnings and the 50K you will get for it as a farm machine etc when your done with it , the $125K was pretty good buying .
so if we are taking shots at alternate brands of excavators i wonder what the usa market will make of doosan now given they've reputedly bought bobcat for access to their dealer network. or are doosan already a mainstream product in the usofa?
Jerry, that's the way I see it too. I made a lot of money fixing those cheap machines that were in the 5-7,000 hour bracket. Most of my customers who had them felt they were too new a machine to turn over and get a new one but too worn out to keep fixing. I think some of the best money making happens once a machine is paid for and is putting dollars straight into the bank. Just seeing the first Doosan machines up in Canada, haven't seen one on a site yet, just siting in the lot waiting for a buyer, so time will tell how it performs. Iron horse, hitachi is a lot better than kobelco.If you can buy a 500 hour hitachi at the same price point as a kobelco it should be an easy decision.
just heard that the irish gov have bought 30 jcb excavators and gone away from doosan.Draw your own conclusions
Well, if they are like our guv, they would probably put the contract out on tender. That or they finally accepted British rule and this is their first attempt at sucking up. :beatsme too!
Dear Sir We sell & export used construction machines I pleased to offer you following machines: - Komatsu PC120-6 - Komatsu PC400LC-6 - Komatsu D31-17 - Komatsu D37E if you are interested in, please let me know. Photos are available. Contact us : [email protected]
are you getting a thumb for it and it looks like a kolbelco
The original post is from 08, I would enjoy an update as to how its holding up.
I have had my Sany 230 for 4yrs now and i have over 10,000hrs on it with no major problums just had to replace a final drive i will post some pics of it
Do tell... I would like to see it
You don't buy parts for throw away equipment.
please elaborate. i would love to see some fotos of your machine with 10,000 hours. in 4 years you sure have been working alot. apart from mining, pipelining most digger's get fewer hours that that per year. at least mine do. 2000 hours is remarkable in a year 1500-1800 about average. although things have been slow so the machines are getting less hours. anyways, no pumps, motor problems on the sany? how about routine pm? are filters and such hard to come by? regards,cd
I call bs on sanyguy. He's obviously a spammer for sany or that equipment dealer or both.
10k hours in 4 years. Hate to do this, but I too call BS....I , on average clock approx. 1500 hours, per year, per machine and thats working as about as hard and long as humanly possible. Trying not to call anyone fake but again 10k hours would be more than I have ever heard of and I have been running heavy equipment close to 40 years. Mining would be the only situation that could possibly make the meter spin to 10k in that short amount of time.
Every one of his posts is spamming for sany. Is anybody else completely sick and tired of chinese junk and they're copying and stealing? Everywhere I look I see chinese junk. I can even tell by looking at the box it comes in. Even the cardboard that comes from there is crap.
His responce dosnt surprise me, I`m glad I asked for the up date.
Thats a lot of hours for 4 years. We have a crew of 50 guys, going 6 12 hour days in the construction season and the most our excavators see are 1,500 hours. And at 1,500 hours on the excavators, that's really pushing everyone with long days. Just as a side note, our company wasn't built by cheap chinese equipment. We've only ever owned Cat until recently we've bought a few pieces of Deere equipment. Our 320BL has 20,000 hours on it and it still gets used daily without any problems. Chinese steel just cannot compare to American steel, and I don't care who disagrees. I'd love to see a Sany make it to 20,000 hours with the same maintenance and amount of parts as our 320BL has needed, it's not possible in my mind. I've been on job sites, working right along side komatsu's and volvo's and I think there is absolutely no comparison. All of the volvo's i've seen leak everywhere around the slew motor, and ring, and blow hoses when you put an attachment on them. I think komatsu's are fine when they're new, but once they get high hours, they turn into junk.
I have seen Hitachis in forestry clocking 15-17 productive work hours per day over two 9 or 10 hour shifts, harvesting pulpwood; 20 000 hours in 5 years or less. Understandably however, 10 000 hours on a Chinese built construction machine working 9-5 for four years does seem a little implausible. If sanyguy can prove it, I will eat my words.
short cuts Can you imagine the reverse engineering shortcuts that have been taken up to the pr stunts.
The Chinese are doing the same thing that the Japanese did in the 60's and 70's. First they copied the motorcycle's of the British and any other bike out there and sold them cheaper here in the U.S. The stupid Americans bought them. They forgot about December 7th, 1941. At the same time they were going after every profitable industry is the U.S. Auto, boat motors, heavy equipment and I would bet there are more. In the 60's the jap's were touring the auto manufacturing plants armed with cameras. The jap's are masters at reverse engineering from taking U.S. cars apart to copying the U.S. auto plants. They most likely did the same thing at the heavy equipment plants and the other items they have all but took over. The Jap's have excellent pr also, the Americans believe every word of it. Now we have a Sany excavator that has worked more hours in a slow economy than any other machine would have worked in a good economy,and it did not need a lot of repairs. BS.The Americans will buy them just like they bought the jap cars and motorcycles because they are cheaper. I was at a bike junk yard, there was not one British bike or Harley in the yard, there were a few of them inside a building. The yard was full of jap bikes, rusting away and waiting to be scrapped. If the jap cars are as good as they say they are why do they build a shop (garage) at the dealership? Give the Chinese a few more years and they will be making Heavy equipment, cars, boat motors, and other things over here in the southern right to work states. They already make refrigerators in a southern state and fly their flag at the factory. At least that is what I was told. Could be BS? The Chinese will improve their products and continue to destroy the US economy. They are already doing a good job of that with their junk that is sold here now. I recommend buying American. There are so many things now that you just can not find a made in USA label on. It is almost impossible to find anything USA made.
Thank you! Couldn't have said it better myself.
We worked on a 3 year road job ack in 2000, i ran a brand new 400 komatsu. In those 3 years i put 6000 hrs on it. We worked from 6:30am to 10Pm alot of days with tower light and all, 10 -11 moths a year. A also call BS on the 10000 hrs thing. I was 20 years old at the time full of **** an vinigar and found it hard working those hrs. Now i find it hard to work 7-12hrs shifts on shut downs, i guess im getting older now.
http://www.forconstructionpros.com/press_release/10634764/sany-america-assembles-first-excavator-in-north-america?cmpid=email_RCL120307009&utm_source=ET+Breaking+Ground+Newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=RCL120307009 Sany America announced the completion of the first excavator assembled at the company’s North American headquarters. At a ceremony attended by Peachtree City Mayor Don Haddix, the 21.5-ton SY215 rolled off of the assembly line at 3:18 pm on February 27, as Sany America personnel gathered to celebrate. “This is a wonderful day for us,” said Jack Tang, president of Sany America. “We have worked hard to make this day a reality and we are looking forward to ramping up our assembly lines. This equipment is tailored to the demands of American operators, and it’s assembled right here in the U.S.” Peachtree City Mayor Don Haddix commended Sany America for the achievement. “Sany America has made a tremendous contribution to our city and country. While so many companies have chosen to outsource production overseas, Sany is one of the few who have brought their manufacturing to the U.S., and we are honored to have them here in Peachtree City,” he said. In addition to excavators, Sany America markets concrete pump trucks, port machinery, rough terrain cranes and crawler cranes in North America. Last fall, the company announced it will build a $25 million R&D center alongside its 400,000 square foot corporate headquarters and manufacturing facility. When complete, the site will employ 300 hydraulic and mechanical engineers.
SANY seems to be putting a good faith effort into it: http://www.sanyamerica.com/abroad/america/en-us/ I recall an article in the press last week about Chinese manufacturing companies now establishing plants in the U.S. Would be interesting to determine if this company is a Chinese government subsidized agency, or did it come here alone. I have no qualms if Sany can furnish heavy equipment with some reasonable degree of durability at a fraction of the cost of you -know-who. Time will tell.
There are a lot of people in this country whose house and driveway are filled with foreign made products, and products of foreign companies and can't figure out why people can't find jobs. Throw all the foreign made heavy equipment out there and it is sitting and not moving dirt. If all the US company's that went out of business were still building Heavy equipment, the US auto plants still had the market share they did in the 70's and all the things that are in your house were still American made. Maybe the heavy equipment that is sitting around would be working. Your neighbors children getting out of high school and college would be able to find a job that would support themselves on their own. Do yourself and your neighbors a favor and buy American when you have a choice. I saw a Chinese add for toys, Made in China by Children for Children. The add might have been a joke, but I would bet there was a lot of truth in it. I am sure Sany can furnish equipment at a fraction of the price of you know who, when they copied you know who and build the parts in China and assemble the product in a economic distressed right to work state in the south. When someone comes to my house driving a foreign car trying to sell me something, they are wasting their time.
OK so when does an item become American or Irish? Did Cat not buy Mitsubishi excavators and incorporate the newly acquired technology to the home built machines?, most of the Cat excavators here are Belgian built, Case and Linkbelt are tie ups with Summitomo so are they American or Japanese? New Holland and Kobelco, JD and Hitachi..............are they true blue American or american assembled and not acceptable........Is an american built Toyota not just that American............... Here at the moment things are tough with the economy in the pan most of the manufacturing jobs have migrated to the east, why because the customer wants it cheaper the manufacturer wants more profit. just a rant........................ Last week end there were a jobs fair with recruiters from Canada and Australia the suspended the Que when it reached a km in length...............
nice looking machine!
They are nice looking units but for me if it isn't made in the good ole USA ,they are not going to get my money for the rest of my days period. I fought too hard and gave up too much for our country to do it any other way. Semper Fi
10 years ago I bought a new Kinze planter. I did the set-up on it. Opening the boxes labeled "proudly made in the USA" I dumped out chinese chain. I was pissed and contacted the company. "Wake up and smell the global economy" was their response. The only thing that smells is US companies falsely advertising. They push as much production as they can to china. Stop by Harley-Davidson and grab one of their $100 accessories off the wall and let me know where it's made?
Georgia is far from "economically distressed".
I hear what your saying....I try hard not to buy anything not made in the USA, not always possible and I get what i need regardless. We need to devote our dollars to the good of our country in order to pass along a chance for generations to come in my humble opinion. I may be wrong but I really think more people have to at a minimum try to buy American made products whenever possible. China will destroy the USA if we let them, that I have little doubt about. You can see it today in our unemployment figures and lack of jobs. Just my opinion and you know what they say about that. Sorry to mess up this thread, stepping down from my soap box now. Semper Fi:usa
How's this? I will look to buy American first. But, If I'm buying Chinese, I would rather buy it at Chinese prices and not pay Harley, Cat, GM, or _______(fill in the blank American named company who has sold out their production lines) mark up for their Chinese made parts. 20 years ago you could choose the American part next to the orient one. Now the american one is gone from the shelf.
American manufactures have gone aboard to get parts cheaper to compete with the foreign manufactures who did not do much in the development of their equipment. If they are having components built in a foreign country it is because they have to, to stay competitive, No one can stay competitive with Chinese and far east labor rates. It is just like the Japanese building auto plants in the southern right to work states with their distressed economy. As for Cat buying Mitsubishi, did they do that to eliminate competition? I would doubt they got any needed technology. Wasn't it Mitsubishi who built those planes with the big red dot on them that dropped all that unwanted debris on Pearl Harbor on December 7th 1941. I would bet Cat shut down their plants just like GM, Ford and Chrysler did to build war supplies so you would have English as your primary language. And the Americans thank them by buying foreign built products. Toyota does a wonderful job of ignoring customer complaints until people start getting killed, then they have to do a recall. Awhile back toyota had the biggest recall ever in Australia for something on one of their cars. I am sure you remember the throttle problem toyota had here a while back. That did not stay in the news long. I do not call toyota an American car, I would be embarrassed to have one in my driveway, I do have a choice on that product line. The economy would not be tough here if the American consumer could buy U.S. made products. Almost everything is made in China and their economy is thriving compared to ours. Just a Rant...............................
Understood........I see what you are saying. If we all just simply make the effort I think it would help. It surely wouldn't hurt anything.
Amen Brother !!!
It seems to be overlooked here that SANY equipment is now going to be make in Peachtree, GA, in a new facilty, by Americans, with U.S. made steel manufactured in plants subject to pollution control laws of the state and the EPA, hauled to destination by American truckers on U.S. roads and run by American operators. It doesn't get more Apple Pie than that these days. When the Korean car brands Hyundai and Kia hit the U.S. auto market, they left a lot to be desired in terms of quality. Then they began the long process of upgrading and built plants in the U.S. Just look at them now.
You may want to check ford on this one.
And all of the funds/Sales proceeds go directly to China !!! Wake up and small the coffee..
its alright spending your american dollars in america ,but japan was and still is the home of manufacturing now branching into china which is spreading world wide , and with all the money america had to borrow off china because of bush ,dont be surprised if the 50 stars are replaced with a chinese flag on all the manufacturing jobs in america, thats the way its going cat dont do quality ,there is no point in buying a name that wont dig a hole ,whereas the chinese and japenese do quality and affordability to points that always win. tayota jap hyundai jap isuzu jap hino jap hitachi jap sumitomo jap tackeuchai jap daewoo jap doosan jap and many many more the best brands in the world hitachi - deere jap sumitomo - link belt - case jap dont knock it until youve tried it and theres no point going to war with china because you borrowed way too much money off them they will wipe you out in a day and take over america for themselves, cat wont do much against sany or luigong then, personally all cat ever done for me was put me to the wall
Whatever you say dear.:usa
And the Germans too...:cool2 Just how much more "distressed" are the economies of the southern states compared to the rest of the US?
What makes you think Ford did not stop building cars, and tooled up to make war supplies to keep English as this country's primary language? I don't get out much but I have never seen for sale any 1942 or 43 or 44 or even a 1945 Ford passenger car. I did see a 1942 Cadillac for sale in an ad, if it existed it was one of very few. I have a picture of one Ford assembly plant making rubber tired armored vehicles with a gun turret. I can't find the picture right now. The Willow run plant made bombers. If you know of one plant that did not make war supplies I would like to know which one it is. Stamping plants don't count. No offence intended but where did you get that idea.
I didn't see it for myself, but a new 336E excavator and a 980K wheel loader rolled into the yard last month, yard guy said that both had window stickers that stated produced/assembled in China. I was shocked!!! So, I did a little research and quickly found this website http://www.caterpillar.com/cda/files/2589127/7/Folks_JanFeb11_color+.pdf once you get to the pdf file, search; ONE TEAM, GLOBAL FOCUS.
to cjplanthire- knock of the b.s.- keep you opinions to your self regarding the u.s and our foreign policies. i just deleted the long winded rant. please have some respect regards,cd
Soooo......does this mean I will soon be able to purchase an excavator at Wal-mart???? New excavator should be priced low enough so when it fails that I can afford to purchase at least one replacement in the coming year, right??????? If not will there at least be some kind of limited one year manufacturers replacement policy? Would love to have a good excuse to back my 9 axle lowboy and 70,000lb excavator into local Wal-mart customer service dept:usa Purchased 3 american brand named, chinese manufactured toasters last year, thank god they were cheap or I woulda had to quit eatin toast.
Does anyone know or care to guess how much cheaper a comparable sized SANY excavator is up against a new 312 CAT?
I don't mind that you've got your own opinion, but PLEASE.....get your facts straight before you go off on a rant. FYI- Bush left office over 3 years ago.
You might find this interesting, no offence taken, I"m also not trying to offend you either just showing a bit of history. Seems like even in hard times money speaks loader then loyalty. Ford established a close collaboration with Germany's Nazi government before the war—so close, in fact, that Henry Ford received, in July 1938, the Grand Cross of the German Eagle medal from the Nazi government. In the spring of 1939, the Nazi government assumed day to day control of Ford factories in Germany. However, Ford's Dearborn headquarters continued to maintain 52% ownership over the factories, since Germany did not seize ownership through nationalization. Ford factories contributed significantly to the buildup of Germany's armed forces
Ford and GM and maybe Chrysler had plants in Europe at the time of WW-2 and they made war supplies for Germany. Germany took them over. Ford and Hitler shared a dislike for a certain nationality of people , which sort of made them friends. Ford did not build a new plant to support Germany like he did West of Dearborn. Below is just a sampling of what is out there of Fords support of the US war effort. And you will find other material both good and bad. Depends on who wrote the article, facts are facts and we all have opinions. When I find it I will post a picture of what Fords, Twin Cities Assembly plant in Saint Paul, Minnesota produced in 1942 http://www.historynet.com/henry-ford-helped-lead-american-world-war-ii-production-efforts.htm http://www.nps.gov/nr/travel/wwiibayarea/for.HTM http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJADd4yrI7o http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYAEBIywGtg&feature=related
I don't follow Caterpillar, I did not know how huge the company is, here are a few pieces of history off a google search. Looks like cat partnered with Mitsubishi in 1963. 1963. Caterpillar and Mitsubishi Heavy Industries Ltd. form one of the first joint ventures in Japan to include partial U.S. ownership. Caterpillar Mitsubishi Ltd. started production in 1965, has been renamed Shin Caterpillar Mitsubishi Ltd., and is now the No. 2 maker of construction and mining equipment in Japan. 1961-1966 - Kobe, Japan Nine Caterpillar machines are involved in the effort to push part of a mountain into the sea as part of the Kobe Bay Reclamation Project. When contractors needed more machines for the project, Caterpillar machines won out over Komatsu machines after on-the-job competitive demonstrations. March 26, 2008 No.1229 MHI, Caterpillar and Shin Caterpillar Mitsubishi Agree on Changes in Shareholding Ratio of Japanese Joint Venture Tokyo, March 26, 2008 - Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, Ltd. (MHI), Caterpillar Inc. (Caterpillar) of Illinois, U.S.A., and Shin Caterpillar Mitsubishi Ltd. (SCM), the Japanese joint venture equally owned by MHI and Caterpillar, have agreed on changes in their shareholding ratio in the JV. The three companies’ respective aims have meshed in concluding the new agreement. MHI is currently promoting selection of focused business areas and concentrating its business resources into those areas; Caterpillar is seeking to strengthen its global business operations in the construction machinery business; and SCM is looking to strengthen its marketing in Asia based on its own strategy. Going forward, each company will promote expansion of its own business while maintaining strong business relationships with its partners. Based on the agreement, MHI will transfer half of its shares in SCM (25% of SCM’s total outstanding shares) to SCM by the end of the third quarter of 2008. Following that transaction, Caterpillar will own 67% of SCM’s outstanding shares and MHI will hold the remaining 33%. The value of the deal is 50 billion yen. The agreement also includes an option enabling SCM to purchase the remaining shares owned by MHI after five years. Although MHI’s shareholding stake in SCM will decrease as a result of the change in ownership structure, MHI intends on further enhancing its value by strategically focusing its management resources into its core competency businesses having high growth potential. MHI and Caterpillar have been in a firm collaborative relationship in the manufacture and marketing of Mitsubishi and Caterpillar brand forklift trucks, and they will maintain that relationship even after the shareholding changes. Both parties also agreed that MHI will continue to supply Caterpillar and SCM with engines for construction machinery, including hydraulic excavators. SCM was originally established as Caterpillar Mitsubishi Ltd., an equally owned joint venture between MHI and Caterpillar, in November 1963; with technological assistance from Caterpillar, it began as a producer and domestic vendor of track-type tractors and wheel loaders. In 1987, MHI’s hydraulic excavator business was transferred to the JV and it was renamed Shin Caterpillar Mitsubishi Ltd. In 2001, SCM further took the transfer of most of MHI’s construction machinery business, including small-size construction machinery, crawler carriers and articulated dump trucks. With the shareholding ratio changes, SCM will now be released from business territory limitations. As a result, the JV is expected to become an ever more important business strategy base for Caterpillar in the Asian construction machinery market. With the completion of the second phase of the share redemption plan, Caterpillar Japan Ltd. will become a 100 percent owned subsidiary of Caterpillar TOKYO, Feb. 29, 2012 /PRNewswire/ -- Caterpillar Inc. (NYSE: CAT) and Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, Ltd. (MHI) announced today that Caterpillar Japan Ltd. (CJL) and MHI have agreed to complete a second phase of a share redemption plan in the second quarter of 2012, resulting in Caterpillar becoming the sole owner of CJL. The estimated value of the second phase of the share redemption is 36.5 billion JPY. Caterpillar and MHI established a 50-50 joint venture more than 45 years ago known as Caterpillar Mitsubishi. In 1987, the joint venture was expanded, and the company was renamed Shin Caterpillar Mitsubishi (SCM). In 2008, following completion of the first phase of the redemption plan, Caterpillar became the majority shareholder in SCM, and the business was renamed Caterpillar Japan Ltd.
Thanks for the links Orville, My father would have been close to 90 today if he were still alive. He was a proud vet, and loved the US. I allways new he hated ford never understood why, on his dying he bed he explained. I realize things were different yesteryear then in todays corporate world. As you write maybe it's a difference of opinion, but I still say a shady deal is a shady deal. Seems to me maybe Ford was just protecting the bank account.
Keep Your Money in north america, We dont need anymore of there Cheap Stuff here.
That's where the big money in the world prefers to rest. Even to the extent of low yielding U.S. Treasury bonds that produce a loss when corrected for inflation. ***, you say? Political stability. You want to lose your money right now, stick it somewhere besides the Good 'Ole USA.
you knock off the ********, bush and the so called american bs dream is the reason the world is in recession ,greedy sobs spending borrowed money on crap they dont need because they think they deserve it. freedom of speech allows people to express their opinion and i wont be dictated to especially by a yank, remember paddy built america and he can take it doiwn as quick, the bs continues about the american history, more like american failure and the problem is ye have no history whats 200 years ,any other country can go back atleast 2000. blowins in yer own country. china is keeping the yanks going with cash at the minute like it or not. bush invaded countries in the middle east to ROB their oil THEIR OIL because he felt like every other american that he deserved it in some far fetched way ,now china are in control as a result and will be for many thousands of years there are more of them than you by atleast 20 fold. as for chinese manufactured machinery - excavators they are the up and coming thing ,the secret about cat (the so called american brand) is out, so go find out why the majority of your so called american brands are actually manufactured by chinese people in china.
Oh my! Somebodies got their panties in a bunch.
This is fair warning to all involved. If discussions can't remain civil take them to another venue. If it keeps up here at HEF you will get a a vacation from our forum. This thread is closed.