Got my hoe going today. I have a problem, well, a few to start with. The brakes pull hard to the left. I was told they were just replaced. Oh well. I will be checking that in the near future. I don't have to pull this on the road. Working all on the farm. Second problem is the drive. In gear 1, when in forward, it is very hard to stop. I have to shift it to N for it to stop all the way. Not good. Even just idling, I have to do this. Is there a way to adjust this? I have to order a shop manual, but till then, any help?
Need to check your idle speed first, it should be set at 700-750 rpm, is your machine a mech shuttle or a power shuttle. If it's a power shuttle there is a dipstick tube over the starter to check the shuttle oil level. We need to know if you have a clutch pedal with a mech forward and reverser or just a power shuttle with a hyd forward/reverser. There are several things that can cause the issue you are having with either.
Hi Sheepfoot and thanks for your reply. It has a power shuttle. More problems to fix on my hoe. None of the gauges work. Today, I'm going to investigate them, but what I saw so far, they look trashed. If so, I will add aftermarket gauges, but will have to wait till I get a shop manual in unless someone could post a electric diagram. This hoe was worked hard in it's pass and wasn't service like it should of been. I think I open a money pit buying this one. Only good thing is that I am able to fix things myself, or try. LOL
The money pit has began. Paid $7K. Had to rebuild one cylinder, $67 Bad Battery, $164 Had to pull the starter for a rebuild. $160 + tax. Still have a ton of work to do, but was able to dig a few stumps up so far.
The brakes do that on my 580C too. Pull to the left and dont want to stop in gear 1. I figure the right brake is siezed up/doesnt work. There is more things going into the right side- park brake cable and diff lock to complicate things. For the no stop in 1st probably just gear ratio allowing the engine to overcome the weak brake.
The guy I bought it from said he just reworked the brakes. Once I get the starter back and install it(tomorrow), I will move it close to my shop and start looking/repairing things like they should be. I could really use a wire diagram. Still waiting on a shop manual.
Put the rebuilt starter in and she fired off with no problem. I need to attack the wiring on this beast.
Don't get too down on it being a money pit. Between the purchase price, transport 250 miles, and many misc parts we're into ours for almost $11000. BUT...So far I've installed my septic, saving me about $5000 plus other projects this past year and snow removal. Plus, I'm half owner of the machine so it's half of those numbers. Point being, I'm sure it will pay for itself on your property too. As far as the brakes, like everyone says, they weren't that good when they were new so don't have high expectations. That being said, I went right through mine and now they are serviceable. I removed the drum cases where the shoes are, cleaned everything up real well. Checked wear left on the shoes(mine were fine). I also rebuilt the master cylinder and replaced the slave cylinders as well as new hoses and fluid. They work fine now and it cost about $100 in parts. Only problem with mine is I have no parking brake. The handle was missing when we bought it. Some day I'll spend the $75 for one, until then an out rigger works fine!
O, one other thing. I believe the diff lock mechanism is on one of the drum cases. I freed mine up while I had it off, it works pretty good now.
Thanks for your response. Got some digging in today and having fun at it. Dang tap roots are deep here. Got 8 stumps up with a bunch more to go. I will be throwing trees too! Not big, about 14"-24" trees. Getting fairly good too! Then I have a right away/ road I have to do. Then dig my pond bigger. I will be using the dirt from my pond to spread on the road. My hoe has a lot of slack, but I knew this when I bought it. That will be a spring time job. Still haven't got my shop/service manual in. I need to redo my dash panel. Nothing works there and the wiring is a mess. I had read all post up to post 100 that had anything to do with a Case backhoe and saw some good write ups along with some good info. One thing I didn't see is when people redid there gauges, did the use electrical or mechanic gauges. Wish someone would post that. I really need to find out how the adjust F/N/R on my hoe. By just putting it in forward, it will take off at idle. Not good due to the fact I'm working in close quarters of trees and a pond.
First like I said before the idle speed has to be set, most will just set there in gear and some will creep a little. The shuttle has only a adjusting rod at the end of the f/r shaft under the machine, the housing has two flats machined in it and a lever that slides up on the shifter spool, when you move to forward the linkage at the shuttle moves and stops on the flat with the detent ball and spring holding it there. The same detent spring and ball holds it in reverse at the flat on the shuttle and lever. There is also a detent spot for the neutral spot using that same spring and ball. As soon as the shift is made pressure locks up the forward or reverse clutch, then as throttle increases the convertor starts transmitting power from the engine to drive the trans. I would due a stall test on the converter 4TH gear should be 1980 rpm, hyd 2100 rpm, and combined should not shut machine off, while also checking the pressures, main pump/shuttle neutral/idle at 65psi, main pump/neutral at 2000 rpm at 130psi, torque converter out at 2000 rpm 30 psi.
Thanks sheepfoot. I did craw under it this afternoon to get a better look at things. Once it warms up tomorrow, I will take a look at the right brake to see what is going on there. The emergency brake is not hooked up, but I see everything there. There are new master and slave cylinders in place, so maybe the brakes were done and the right one just needs some adjustment. I also need to get a couple gauges hooked up to see oil pressure and water temp ASAP. I don't like running something without knowing what it going on.
OK, I did get a look at things. The good thing is that I know a bunch of BW trainnies. Had them in boats before and there is little to no difference in this one. LOL Yesterday, I pulled the gauge/dash off and clean everything. (gauges) The tack works, but the tack cable needs to be replace. Busted at the engine. The voltage gauge works too. But I have a problem all together for the package. PO had installed a aftermarket key switch and nothing is powering the gauges. So, I think today I will start tracing out the wires and start rewiring. If all the gauges are good, I will use them, but will rewire them. I pulled the package apart and I saw that I would be able to wire direct to each gauge by pulling the clips and wire ribbing card off and just add nuts to the back of the gauges. I could also add new warning lights in the same spots were the old ones are now. I see this is going to take a long time to do. I still haven't got my service/owners manuals in. I could use a wiring color code what Case has used on this equipment if anybody knows it. That would save a lot of time. Besides that, after looking at the wiring, it has seen it's better days. Now, a little about me. I'm 55 years old, married to a great woman for 34 years and have two great kids, one married and one great grandson. Bad thing for me is that I had to retire a few years ago after 30+ years on the job due to heart failure. Picked up a infection that wiped out my heart. I do see a heart transplant team once a month and I have my good and bad days. I'm a outdoorsman that used to love to hunt and fish, but that is very limited now. So now, when I feel good, I push myself to the limit at every chance. LOL I'm a DIY's kind of guy. Only problem that I can't do is weld anymore due to having a CRT-D implant.
Got a few dummy lights working, so that is a good thing. I have a bunch of oil leaks. Power steering, the loader spool valve, and now the power shuttle, I think. Found out the reason as to why it will not idle/move in gear, or so I think. The PO must of used the wrong oil in it along with it being real low. It's a doctor day for me, so today is shot. Have to drive 130 miles one way for a appointment that takes 20 mins unless my blood work doesn't look good. If that is bad, then 3-5 days in the hospital. If all is good, I will stop to pick up a 5 gallon bucket of good oil for the power shuttle. I will drain it, clean the suction screen, drain the converter and refill it. Run it to flush it out and drain, refill again. Yesterday after a bunch of digging (around 5 hours), I found out that it didn't want to shift forward like it should, but would shift in reverse like it should. Once it did, it had all the power to move like it should. That lead me to believe that there is the wrong oil in it. I do a full check on fluid levels before starting, but I didn't catch the low level on the power shuttle like I should of. My bad. I did refill, but still had the same problem of a delay of about 10-15 seconds of going forward. At this point, in between working on the hoe and working the hell out of it, I been having fun. Yesterday I fell a few trees. Had a double tree that gave me a hard time, but I got them down. The root ball is going to be very hard to get it out the hole and move. It's that big, but I'm sure I will get it done.
If you PM we with an email I can send you a copy of the PDF manual or at least a copy of the pages for the wiring code. Not great, but it helps. Include you email address in the PM, or private email option. Manual is only 150MB, so your ISP should let er go through without issue. Gauges, Took ours apart couple of months ago, mud daubers (wasps) had built nest in them ruining the gauges. Plus some fool broke off one of the retaining clips on the main wiring loom that plugs into the instrument panel. Looks kind of like the ones Dodge used in cars, but I digress. Replacement factory gauges good luck. I did find one for $30, NOS but it is the second series gauge and would be colored differently than the first series. Gauges are all electrical, except the tach as best I can make out. Then there all the different warning lights, all mine were burned out, and switches. Figure I will be working on this project for quite a little while. Would have liked to stayed with the factory gauges, but too costly, if you can find them, so will be doing a little "farmerization" to the unit. B-I-L, the actual farmer, gets upset when I call jury-rigging the farmerization term. no sense of humor I guess.
I got my gauge package fixed. What I did was removed the wire ribbon, traced it to how it ran and hard wired everything direct to the gauges. All gauges work and after cleaning the cover lens, I'm able to see them. I had installed warning lights too along with an engine oil pressure gauge. Another member here sent me a copy of the wire diagram which help out a lot. Still, another member suppose to mail me a complete shop manual on CD. I bought one off ebay which was trash. Oh, more money into the money pit. 4 more hoses 3 more cylinder kits 30 gals of hyd oil 2 springs for the brakes 1 bucket bushing On order 2 more Cylinder seal kits A set of service tools Though I had a cracked swing cylinder, but oil is leaking from around the gland seal. Also, I have all the control valves leaking were the rods come out. I will tackle that in the near future.
Hi Fishfighter I mailed the CD on Monday, You should get by Thursday Ron
Thanks Ron. If there is anything I can do to help you or another member, please let me know.
Guages I am planning on doing my gauges as well on mine. They sell a electronic "tiny tach" for diesels that reads the pulse of the #1injection line. It must be for a diesel engine though and of course the cost goes up. I would just use 12v gauges somewhere there was a write up on this forum. Check Amazon for prices on gauges they are usually cheaper and most offer free shipping!!!!!
I did read that thread with aftermarket gauges. I was about to go that route, but I started checking my gauges and found that they still worked. The wiring was a big mess with a lot just not hooked up on my hoe. That and of course the ribbon wire card on the back of the gauges was shot. So that is when I just hard wired everything. I still have to replace the transmission oil temp sending unit. Mine is broke. The good thing is that I don't have to put my hoe on the road or move it much. Got a new oil leak yesterday.:Banghead One of the tubing lines that feeds the extendedhoe is leaking at a coupling. I tried tighten it with no luck. Can one just cut off those flange and redo them? There is no oring, just a flair flange. Would hate to have to change those lines right now.
My gauges are actually bad, the circuit board surprisingly fairly good. plastic will have to be polished to see through, etc., the normal. I feel the converter temp fairly important, under all conditions, so will replace in some manner. I can't remember which gauge I actually found but might be that one. I did a national search. Do the computer work for a diesel repair shop so access to their parts pipeline. I'm a little confused, and have not traced the electronics, on the warning light circuit for a plugged hyd filter, etc, but just need time to sit down with the panel, schematic and think about it. When I power-washed things here a couple of weeks ago before we pulled the injection pump, we noticed the dipper bucket cyl fitting leaking like a sieve, assume the o-ring is bad but temps dropped back to single digits and have not re-visited. If you have a crack in the actual tubing/fitting that is a whole different bag of worms ( money pit - oh do I understand. ) We have a couple of companies here that do only hyd hoses and cyls. I would first take the fitting completely apart and see if you can specifically determine the issue. Crack in the flair, tubing or fitting block itself. Then multiple pictures and off to the hyd shop for a reasonable solution. I can't quite picture where this connection is for you in my mind so can't make a specific recommendation. I'll want to know what you find and come up with. If you can post a photo, I'm sure someone has been there before or I can figure out a fix. The tubing's flairs can crack when overtightened to the max or run loose under a lot of vibration. There is always a work around!!!!!
To me, it looks like the tube flair has been over tightened and not sealing anymore. I will try to get some pictures to post, but that might not be till next Monday.
Case part number for the tubing is D76418 were it is leaking. It's a .75 OD steel tube. There is a "A" and a "B" that join together. At those fittings, that is were it is leaking very bad. I did disconnect them to check for any cracks and didn't see any. Anyone have any luck cutting these tubes, flaring them out again? I will check a shop local to see if they have tubing to make new lines if I can't just use what I have. It might be cheaper to just have hoses made to replace the tubing too!
I went to the "Case" on line diagrams, and although I didn't find your specific part number, I assume it is one of the longer lines listed as #10 or #11. I don't have access, at the present, to see if those lines are double or single flairs. I'll assume double, which is very hard to do well in the field. Flaring tubing in general, brake lines specifically, never worked out really well for me over the past 40 years. Again your hyd shop would likely have that answer, but you certainly could put in a hose as a temp/permanent fix . I'm sure its been done before. I'll see a diesel tech this week that has worked on only heavy equ for the past 35 years and ask him if he has run into this kind of thing before and what he did to fix.
Two responses on another board dealing with the same issue, the "brake flair tools are set at 45degrees. Hydraulic uses a 37 degree JIC flare. There are franchises that fabricate fluid lines. One I work at part time is "Tubes and Hoses" Perhaps there is one in your area. If your're in the country, take it down to your friendly Grange supply or the equivalent. They will probably put the flare on for you at minimum or no cost. They will out here in the Palouse. Now having lines made up from scratch - that gets pricey. So the answer is yes, the right shop can re-flair it for you so you don't have to replace the steel line, but will shorten it probably 1 to 1 1/2 inch .
Here's a flaring tool on ebay http://www.ebay.com/itm/New-Deluxe-Flaring-Tool-37-Degree-For-AN-Fittings-/261405049209
Ron, I got the CD in. Thanks, it's already been a great help. $100 for that tool? I'm going to talk with my local shop that makes up my hoses. I'm sure then can flair the ends. I pulled it apart again today. No cracks. It looks like its just leaking thru the threads.
Your Welcome. Glad I could help. Good luck on the repairs Ron
Got another problem yesterday. LOL One of the stabilizers lower pin backed out. The pin went towards the inside/tire. Also, I lost the bushing for the outside. How in the world that happen? Oh well. Got to looking at it and I will just try to remove the other bushing in the inter hole that is not used. If that doesn't work, guess I will have to buy a new one. The good new is that I'm almost finished throwing trees in the area I been working. Just have to finish stacking them to burn. Bad thing is that another cold front has hit us. The last two days were hitting in the upper 70'sF. This morning it is back in the low 30's F with a 20+ MPH wind. WET! My pond has been overflowing and my yard is so wet, that one has to wear rubber boots. Now I'm sure y'all guys up north had enough winter. I know I have. LOL Oh, tomorrow is Mardi Gras here. This old man is planning on staying home. Will be to cold and wet!
Update on those steel lines. I did talk to my local shop. They can't reflair them. Case wants well over $200 for those two lines. So what I did was pulled them both, clean the fittings real good. Then I mixed a batch of JB weld epoxy steel and applied that and bolted them together. I did that Wednesday after getting home from the hospital for my weekly infusion. After doing that, I started feeling real bad and had to lay down. Yesterday early morning, I had to return back to the hospital, feeling that bad. Feeling a bit better this morning though. If the line leaks after this, I can take it to my local shop and they will weld the two lines together. The only reason I see as to why there is a joint there is so one can replace just part of the line(top section) that feeds the extended hoe hose. If that doesn't work, I could have a hydraulic hose made up for that section which would work too and would be less then half the price of the steel lines.
I have replace several steel lines with hoses - that is what I would do. If you need a flaring tool, check out Autozone or Advanced Auto Parts to see if they have a loaner tool. That has saved me a lot of money!
Why didn't I think of that. LOL Thanks. I did put that line to the test and it held only to find a new leak. One of the boom lift cylinders had a cut in it's side. To me, it looks like the PO had let a pin back out the boom that rubbed on the cylinder tube, putting a small crack in it. Broke out the welding equipment and ran a bead. It's holding so far. Didn't get a chance to see if I could get that other stabilizer bushing free. Just wasn't up to it feeling like crap. Maybe tomorrow.
Got on the hoe for a little seat time today. No big leaks. Still have to do something on the stabilizer bushings soon.
Got back from my doctors appointment and was feeling good. So I stopped and picked up some 3/4" all thread and some big washers. Made a tool to pull one of the extra inside bushings on the stabilizer. Had to disconnect the ram from the stabilizer leg and then I had to remove that. The tool worked great along with the right size pipe to fit. Couple bumps, the bushing came out. The tool I made just pulls the bushing back in. For the outside bushing, I had to order that one along with a couple caps. I guess one just grinds out the old caps and welds the new ones back on. Anybody ever do that? I am planning on using the pin to keep it bore sighted. I will check to see if there is anything in the shop manual.
OK, got the new outside bushing in yesterday, Had to grind around were it slips into place to get it to fit in. Once I did that, I put the pin in place. Then I had to weld a few passes all around to build up a new lip. Worked like a charm. Next thing I will tackle is the control valves to repack all them. Any tips? I saw were people are making a tool, but didn't see any pictures of it. Can someone post a picture of it?
Did a real good one yesterday. Was moving big root balls with the loader hanging with chains. As I was moving one, I crossed a deep rut which swung one back into my radiator, pushing it into the fan. Great, have to weld the front grill back together. Crack that in half. Hoping a shop can repair the radiator. If not, aftermarket best price shipped is going to cost $400+. OUCH!
I would move the stumps I dug out the same way with a chain because I could not get them to stay in the bucket. Lack of experience using a backhoe I guess. It never ends fixing them. Ron
I always get a stump into the bucket as far as it will go and then chain it to the bucket. A lot of them were so big I had to roll the bucket into the dump position, otherwise I couldn't even lift them. Doing it that way the stump will not swing freely and destroy a radiator. There have been times when I clamped them in the backhoe to move them.
Hine sight is a b-t-h. LOL
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I was able to get it repaired yesterday. Cost me another $150. Guess that is better then having to pay $400 for a new aftermarket one. Got it installed yesterday afternoon and just have to fill it. Lesson learn. Oh well. Have a couple more trees to throw today before more rain comes. The ground is very wet. Water table is only 18" down right now. Everywhere were I dug up trees, after back filling, the spots are very very soft. Is there anything I can do about that? Or will it harden up once dry season comes in the summer. These holes are like quicksand.
Well, with some seat time from my last post, I broke two hoses and one of the steel boom lines and a Tee fitting. LOL On the steel line, I replaced it with a hose. Had to make a few brackets and so far working good. Of course the wife has not been a happy camper too!
Whoa you are really getting it done and pretty quick. I'm right behind you with some similar concerns. I'm working on getting my guages to work and rebuilding cylinders. I've yet to really see full capability of my machine due to cylinders needing packing. But I never thought that they would take down 24" trees. Are you doing this by pushing them or digging up first?
Digging them up/around the base of the trees. Then use the hoe side to push them over and help guide them were to fall. I have a extender hoe which helps keep me safe. Don't try this on windy days unless you can push with the wind.
hey I have a 580c that I just got and could use a copy of that wiring code as well my email is [email protected]
Welcome to HEF, Rick ! Check your email inbox ! Let me know if you received the file. There were 29 pages from the service manual in it.