I purchased a piece of land with an old CAT D8 dozer on it. As far as I know, it hasn't ran in years. I'd like to sell it if it's worth something, otherwise I'll use it as a jungle gym. Could you help me figure out what exactly it is and maybe a rough price? And perhaps recommend how to go about selling it? I assume it needs to be put on a wide load truck, and maybe even have the blade removed. Here's a link to a folder with a bunch of photos: https://drive.google.com/folderview?id=1HtZkes7LZ_Qlsf0TEMBEmN4aaE3Y1YUM I'm in Livingston Manor, NY... about 2 hours away from NYC. Thank you, kindly!
It's got a hydraulic blade so isn't that old. I'm no expert but would guess it's a D8H. It looks like it might be a good candidate to get running again but that would depend on what all is wrong with it. It looks complete though and not half torn apart.
That,s a really straight early 46A Cat D8H, looks like it would not take much to get it going , wonder why it was left?
it appears to be a D8 46A older than serial #46A3888 by the track frames (the way the rollers mount and also the way the upper carrier rollers are faced outward. that would make it early 60's vintage approximately. physically, it looks good for its age according to the pictures. if the engine is not seized, it may run, although there could be other costly issues internally, especially not knowing the history of the machine. if it was me i would try to get it running, or at least determine what's wrong with it. i have one that is a few years newer than that one
Question is will it run. Agreed it's an early 1960's model with the front mount 183 Hydraulic Control (36Exxxx), hydraulic blade and ripper. Running it would probably be in the $10 to $20K range and appears to have plenty of life left. Not running it's a boat anchor money pit that you would probably have to pay to get it hauled off.
It looks good to me, the only thing I see is the left track is backwards. Minor issue.
Hmmmm. I would be tempted to check the fluids and put some heat in it. I know of several large machines that were just parked as runners and never used again. Wish I could buy property similarly equipped.
At least has a Rain Rattle on it, so MAYBE has not been soaking up weather as bad as some. Finding out if engine is locked or not, as noted checking fluids, potentially replacing at MINIMUM Engine oil and filters then doing a pressure lube prior to start attempt, draining fuel tank and flushing to filter heads, adding Some fresh fuel then batteries in that order to see if will run. As a Boat anchor a 8 is Hard to move, takes special equipment, a crew to somewhat disassemble for transport then get another machine near as big to shove the dead carcass onto a transport trailer. They WILL charge you to remove a Dead Machine.
Good Point Dave, and better thought out in then my observation. I was giggling maniacally inwardly at just the thought of it actually blowing smoke and moving!
seeing if that machine would run is something i would tackle just for fun and pure entertainment! but, that is just me or somebody like me lol
Yes 56, there are others of us old dinosaurs that would light that old pig up just for the joy of it. Sweet old pig, even has a pony motor. If you can fire off the pony, you WILL get the diesel to run. And you do realize that those of us that know the correct way to fire an old pony motor machine are becoming a dying breed. And like the sound of that pony, we are becoming a part of history...
Ya, I wish I lived closer, I would be over there in a heartbeat.Grew up with these machines,the exhaust right in front of you, no wonder I have tinnitus.The smell of Black exhaust & the sound of the engine ticking over in the morning is something I Will never forget.Remember going with my dad building logging roads in BC the sounds echoed off the rocks , I was about 14 now 69. First Cat I operated was a Diesel 75 last One was D9T, retired in 2013. Have a nice Day, Ken
I completely ignored the Pony down in the hole, that will be its own nightmare if sat a long time, gas varnished, corrosion.
fredk, post this on the Antique Caterpillar Machinery Owners board. https://www.acmoc.org You can see how many here are drooling over that old dog. You can likely find someone there with the money and time to pay for it and move it off the land. When I worked for a Cat dealer we figured the worth was the percentage of wear left on the undercarriage. A new undercarriage is probably around $35,000 installed now days. I'm guessing the chains are not SALT and that the bushings have been turned so thinking the undercarriage at about 70% worn. That's about $10,500 that might be offered on trade, if it runs, and an asking price of $15,000 on the dealer's lot. Most of us old timers might be interested in a yard ornament for around $5,000. If it can't be made to run, it's worth what it weighs less break down and transportation. It's about 20 ton at $80 a ton or $1,600 less break down and transportation. Were it me and I wanted it gone, I would advertise it for a token value with a dead line to remove it.
fredk, You can download Google Earth Pro (free) and use the timeline option at the top (alarm clock). Find your D8 location and go through the years , as far back as 1997. Let us know a better estimate of how long it's been sitting. If you were closer I'd been there by now.........
It is kind of entertaining hunting for it! )
Found it! It isn'll that far from here... 4 hrs Hmmmm. I'd have to tear down the garage to get an 8 to the back of the property. That probably would only take a second...
I just watched this old film the other day
Thank you for all the input, everyone! So, I was able to get some more info, but it's a little complicated so bear with me. We acquired this property a few months back but have been living next door for about 8 years now (it was sitting the whole time). The previous property owner passed away and his wife sold us the property. The previous owner's son (who I'm in contact with) says the machine is in working condition, it's just been sitting for a while. The machine was apparently sold to someone (who I'm also in contact with) who wanted to ship it to Guatemala but was unable to find an affordable way to do so. Last year, the buyer was able to get the pony motor going but couldn't get the diesel going (my brother witnessed it). He has since given up on it and wanted to sell it before the property was sold to us, but was unable to do so. I think since it was on the property when we bought it, it technically belongs to us but I'm not certain how that works. I'm willing to help him out because that's what I'd like someone to do for me if I was in a similar situation. He barely speaks English and had trouble selling it so I'm going to try to sell it for him and we'll split the sale, since I'll be doing the leg work. I'm not sure what his expertise is with a machine like this, and it's hard to understand him, so I'm thinking it may be worth having someone knowledgeable come take a look at it. I'm going to post it on https://www.acmoc.org/ as suggested. Let me know if you have any other input on how I should proceed. I'm thinking I should have someone knowledgeable take a look at it (where do I find this person?) and hopefully get it running (how much should I bother investing in it?) and then perhaps post it for sale on the internet (for how much?) Thank you all for your time, it is much appreciated.
Here is a question.... did the old cable hoist tractors have down pressure?
Downloading Google Earth Pro now... I'm in contact with the previous land owner's son but I think Google Earth would be more accurate than asking him.
Are you off County road 151, kind of East? I found the D8 pointed slightly SSW, Was being used seriously 2012, 2016 was where it currently sits.
Was using my version, picked out where grade work(Root Rake) had been used recently. Seems to have been at least four machines on site in '12, then this one left likely between 12 and 14 as no rails marks around it but also minimal brush growth in '16.
No. You could crank the blade angle braces out some to change edge angle of attack, or crank one forward to tilt, but no down pressure.
We're in the middle of the woods =p It's in the same place going back to 2012 (which is when we moved next door), any earlier and it's impossible to make anything out in the photos. The property is actually a sustainability education campground owned by non-profit Haven for Humanity (havenforhumanity.org) You can find the D8 here: 41.9478829248, -74.805942142
Oh I don’t know. Looks good to me
nope I'm another one that would be there if it was closer
one of you has to be nearby, come on! =p
I am 4 hours out... I am a operator though. You need a New York version of John C who appraises and wrenches or a good wrench.
4 Hours?!!? You wimp! I am over 12hrs away.
Do you know how much the buyer paid for it? Might be a good idea to offer his money back or a portion of it and then fix it and/or sell it yourself. It is technically your machine if it wasn't picked up and there was nothing excluding it in the sale of the property. The buyer might be happy to get a percentage of his money back and not have to deal with it. If he has a problem you can give him a specific time to have it removed.
NO. Just the weight of the blade. The shape helps them cut.
Very good idea posting it on ACMOC. We have members all over the country and beyond. There is a good chance that a member will come and help you, or at least show you how to start it. As the pony ran fairly recently and you know it was good when parked, you are more than half way there. Wonder how far Chum Duffy is from you. He has many of them and occasionally gets another.
If you just want to try and start it. I can drive over and give you a hand. If the main didn’t light the last time it was tried it might have a fuel supply issue. A set of filters and some clean water free fuel may be in order as mentioned earlier. If the machine is yours. I really don’t want to get in a range war over implied ownership.
LOL!
Major failure years ago may be why is still sitting. As noted in 2012 photos were three other machines and all of those gone, age, repairs costs/expense to move and this machine may have become a sacrificial anode. In that frame of mind, work to get the Pony started, and as MD Stated fuel and filters then see if will at least run.
Keep in mind if that's a 46A1 to 46A3043 s/n it has the fuel torque converter. Parts for that TC are about extinct. Fuel quality is even more critical on one of these.
The buyer said he paid 14k, but I don't have any way to verify this since the previous owner passed. He told us if we can sell it, he'll split it with us and I think that's fair, so I'm not going to bother trying to claim ownership of it. Interestingly enough, we were offered a measly $1000 for it and he was willing to consider it, yet I refused. It's worth more to me as a jungle gym. He's given us full authority to do what we will with it. No one in my crew has any expertise when it comes to this kind of thing, so if anything, we would be the ones giving you a hand, MD. I'm going to speak with the current owner and try to find out what he's already attempted to do with it... may be difficult because of language barrier but I'll do my best. We'd be willing to compensate a bit for assistance in the matter.
1st step is to get the serial number.....
Ripper likely has Rear number covered, Zoomed in on Dash, NO S/N tag nor rivet holes, going to be by Engine Number plate I do believe, IF it still exists. My bet is a 36A.
I am only available on a weekend as I am employed full time, however I am usually around. You won't owe me anything. If you decide to do it ,let me know and I will come do it for giggles. I haven't sat on an H in awhile.
engine serial # should be stamped above the oil pan on the block if the tag is not there. only good if the block is original. a lot of these old machines no longer have the original block. 36a is a standard, 46a is a powershift
Forgot that aspect, it is a PS.
A couple people from ACMOC are coming to tinker with it on Saturday, you're welcome to come too, if you'd like! I'll be getting the seriel number shortly
Sounds like you are in very good hands. The people I know from ACMOC are pretty talented. You most likely don't need me. Although it might be kind of a fun ride and some fodder for my photography affliction, looks kind of picturesque out your way. I will let you know Friday. Be kind of fun to watch fresh smoke blow...
You are more than welcome to come - I'll keep you posted on their schedule. I really appreciate you offering to come help. edit: everything should start turning green by then, too
I appreciate that, Thanks! Do keep me posted it is definitely an interesting project!
serial number, i think: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1h83jCaFQ4AvzFQYyK9I_O2X9S2UkdFO6
Yep!
It's a 1961 model tractor. I wouldn't think it has a fuel converter but it is definitely a low horsepower engine.
ya, low horse until at least s/n 46a 10724 based on my parts book
The posted S/N would seem to confirm that it has a fuel torque converter, no..? That would be of course assuming that the block is original.
Was also wondering that. Could be the likely reason is now sitting.
Wasn't there a conversion campaign on those around the mid 80s? Replacing the Fuel Converter with a Hydraulic Fluid type?
Well if some people are coming to see about firing it up be sure to take a video if at all possible.
That is a fuel torque converter model and has it's challenges for bleeding the fuel system.
will do thank you for all the input!
Any update?
Follow up is on the ACMOC bulletin board. All came to a stop when it was discovered the pony motor has a thrown rod.
If that was the only problem might it still be worth looking into fixing?
That is the $50 000 question. Spend money fixing that, to find out something else is wrong.
Next up call a scrapper to make a offer
Well that sucks. I was hoping for a different outcome.
Here's the write up from ACMOC and the wonderful guys who came to take a look (we're going to proceed with attempting to get it running, slowly but surely): "Norm and I visited Fred's place yesterday and checked the tractor over. It appears in generally good condition. The rollers have wear and best I can estimate are down 1/8 from the radius at the side. The rails are right on 5" if someone could please restate that in % worn. The sprocket segments are new. The grousers have been built up and are in good condition. Norm drained the sediment and maybe an ounce or two of water from the main fuel tank , while I checked the pony. Unfortunately the last person to run the pony threw a rod in it. The pony starter would not roll over the engine so I removed the clutch adjustment cover and the spark plugs , and was able to roll the pony crank backwards. The back piston moved. I hit the pony starter button momentarily and the pony turned over then stopped with a clunk. There are no smoke relief holes in the pony block so the best case is that only a rod let go and the rest is intact. How it got into this state is another example of where a lack of knowledge and intuition can lead to problems. Someone removed the throttle and choke control rods, and installed the choke control rod into the throttle rod position, presumably to control the pony rpm. In doing this, the governor control rod was removed from the throttle. I suspect that this led to an over-rpm situation and hence the thrown rod. A competent mechanic familiar with governors would know that this would require very careful manual control of the throttle and erring on the side of low rpm. In other areas, the underside of the main engine oil fill cap showed no sign of condensation and there are no obvious oil leaks on the machine, including from the finals. The oil was down the stick about an inch and a half - the oil could stand changing. The coolant was full and bright green. All the gauges were intact. The pony fuel valve was replaced by an elbow so there's no current way to shut the fuel off. The light switch was stuck but I didn't see any lights anywhere on the machine - maybe the gauges have lights? The torque convertor bleeder was slightly open and dry. I didn't open it right up to see if any diesel would flow. The powershift control level would not move, even with the safety off - Eddie , should it be able to move through the gears with the engine not running? The cutting edges looked new, the blade skin has been patched and there's a small hole in the lower corner that needs a patch. The blade joints looked reasonably tight. The blade has manual tilt arms which do move. So, to get the tractor going, the pony needs the thrown rod and whatever else in there is broken repaired/replaced. The basic sequence that I could see to remove the pony is: 1. Drain the coolant - how many gallons? 2. Remove the mag and carb for safety purposes 3. Remove the two coolant pipes 4. Remove the main exhaust pipe 5. Remove the hood 6. Remove the main engine air cleaner and the pony air cleaner 7. Attach lifting eyes to a couple of pony head bolts (I think there is a lifting jig description on the forum) 8. Carefully bar the pony and transmission forward away from the main engine flywheel housing. As it comes forward, tilt the pony up to clear the filter assemblies. Question - there is a 2" diameter pipe that looks like a coolant (or fuel) pipe that runs alongside the pony. Does that have to be removed to remove the pony? It is not solidly fixed in place so has a bit of movement available. I've offered to Fred if he can get the pony to me, I'll fix it. I think the only way that tractor will be sold off the property is if it is running, because the only other feasible option (outside of taking another D8 up there to drag it on to a lowboy) is to see off parts. In that case, Fred will inevitably be left with a carcass that for sure will never move unless scrap turns to gold. Cheers, Neil."
Would it be feasible to convert it to electric start?
That was the first thing I offered. But apparently these early models didn't always have the mounting bosses taped for the starter and that's the case here. Still wouldn't be all that difficult to do.
It sure sounds like it's worth looking into.
there are a couple bolts under the pup engine crankcase that secure it to the main engine block that you cannot see unless someone has left them out
Man somebody should be filming this for youtube... They love the cat videos I post on my Channel.
I'll take some photos/video next time we have a wack at it, and will be sure to keep you all updated
so, the gentleman that actually moved the dozer into its current location years ago is interested in it, and will be coming up to check it out... i told him where we left off
Check out my friend Squatch253. Lots of very detailed repair and restoration videos.
Hello everyone, the time has come to sell this bad boy. The only update is that someone has been tinkering with the pony motor recently and I'm not sure where they left off but we've run out of time and need to sell. I will investigate further and try to get more details but wanted to start the process. Thank ya'll again for everything and I'll be posting on the antique forum also.
Oh an old bubble nose shoulder buster D8, worth about $2,000 to $10,000 if it runs, and personally I would not ever want one, my arm just can't take it.
We were given an offer of 4k we're strongly considering We're in Livingston Manor NY
Sold for 5k
Hope you give them a kiss at that price. Bad Bob
Some are just gluttons for punishment. Bad Bob!!