I have a D4H Caterpillar and need to remove a hydraulic cylinder that is leaking so it can be repaired. I'm stuck trying to remove a pin that holds the cylinder. I thought someone might have a good idea or maybe there are some special tools that are needed. The pin at the other end is loose and ready to come out. So far, this pin will not budge. I have put some "blaster" on it as well as oil. I have tapped the pin head and used a crow bar to move it but no luck. The rope you see is connected to a front end loader to lift the cylinder and remove any stress from its weight. I'm looking forward to learning any incantations (I have used many of the more obscene ones) that will loosen this pin.
The easiest is going to be pulling the rod and gland out the other end and rebuilding them, then installing back on with that pin and cylinder never leaving the machine. There are all kinds of strategies to get that pin out, from hollow porta power cylinders and threaded rods, to bottle jacks, to jack hammers or hydraulic breakers, to cutting next to the cylinder with a sawzall, to drilling the pin, to oxygen lancing the pin out. What do you feel like?
I have to say, I don't feel like any of those. I believed that this would be the easiest and be the best result, but now you are making me rethink that. Where can I find some info on rebuilding the cylinder? Will that take any special tools? What makes this pin so hard to remove? Is it corrosion?
You need to determine where it is stuck , either in the ram or the pin holders . Either way its going to require heating . That looks easy to get at so its going to be a simple heat and drive with a heavy hammer . Before the heat extend the ram so the piston is away from any heat . Last lift ram I did I used a length of pipe that fitted over the pin and a long rod , far longer than the pipe and used it like a shock hammer after heating . I've never used any special tools but every thing is different . Depending on how the piston is retained on the spear you may need a large spanner , I used a 36" pipe wrench on one and the last one I did had 2 half moon shaped retainers set in the rod to retain the piston held by 3 10 mm bolts , that was an easy job . It will be corrosion thats holding it , is there no grease nipple on the ram ? .
That's the first challenge. The bigger the better. You need the proverbial FBH. Obviously you have access to hit one end of the pin. Is there any access to hit the other end.? I'll be honest and say that I'm not a fan of disassembling cylinders on the machine, but that's just me.
Yes. Most likely it's never been out before.
My best guess is that the pin is stuck in the ram. I'm thinking since I have been using the dozer and lifting the blade it would be rotating in the pin holders and stuck in the ram. I guess the only way to tell would be to spend the dough for some hydraulic oil and fill it up. I could then raise the blade and watch the pin to see if it moved or not. If it moves, then it is the ram. If it stays steady, then it is the pin holders. There is no access to hit the opposite side of the pin. If I heat the ram, do I run the risk of damaging any internal parts?
You might have to fabricate some kinda big *** slide hammer. Do you have fabrication skills?
You need to extend the ram to move the piston away from the heated area to stop any damage to it . If the pin was moving in the holders there would be tell tail marks in the pin holder retainer slot
Pull the other pin and lift that end of the cylinder to see where the pin is stuck. I bet it's stuck in the ears, which makes it harder because they'll want to bend and bind when you hit it with a hammer or pull on the pin. To avoid this you have to pull on the pin while applying force to the ear/"boss" around the pin, that's where a hollow porta power cylinder comes in. The inside will still bend the ear and bind unless you can add shims between the cylinder and inside ear to support that. Sometimes they'll come lose without all that, so you're not losing much just hitting it with various hammers, the worst you do is make it more stuck and still have to cut it, or rebuild it in place. Cat and Nige would prefer you hone the cylinder when you rebuild it, but these seals are probably original and just falling apart with age, sometimes literally coming apart in big pieces when you pull the rod out. You can inspect the bore and piston when you get it out to see if it needs anything besides new seals.
What do you think, take the two retainers put one in its place loose the other one 180° then get a piece of steel thick enough burn a hole so it fits over the pin and butts onto the retainers, weld them all together and get some sharp steel wood wedges. Some heat and the BFH. You might have to buy new retainers after.
With a big pipe wrench, I just resealed both lift cylinders on our D4H by leaving the barrels on the machine. Remove and cap lines (8orfs, IIRC), loosen gland nut with pipe wrench, remove rod end pin, support cylinder upwards, then finish removing gland. Extract rod, remove piston, reseal all, then reverse to assemble. Easy peasy. The barrel pins would not come out on ours, either.
Find a section of tubing (can be PVC, exhaust tubing, or anything similar) that fits easily over the pin diameter, with about 1/8"-3/16" clearance to the pin. Cut off a short length of this tubing, seal one end with another small flat section, using urethane or silicon sealant - or a welded plate if you're using exhaust tubing. Fabricate two of them. Cut or drill a hole in the side of the tubing, large enough to allow you pour some PB Blaster or panther pee of your choice through it. Place the short sections of tubing over the protruding section of the pin (one each on inside and outside) with the hole positioned at the top - seal it well against the lugs with some more sealant, allow sealant to dry. When sealant is dry, pour your panther pee into the hole in the tubing, so the area between the pin and lug is fully covered with panther pee - the sealed tubing is acting like a dam to hold the penetrant in place around the entire lug hole. Leave filled with penetrant for at least 24 hrs, top up again with penetrant, if needed - then remove tubing and try hammering on the head of the pin, using a soft drift between hammer and pin. As Nige says, use a BFH, tapping with a ball peen engineers hammer will get you nowhere. If the pin moves inwards, it will then be able to be removed outwards using a big slide hammer and bearing jaws. When replacing the pin, clean up the holes to bright metal and use plenty of nickel anti-seize in the holes upon re-assembly.
Being the pin sticks out some, could you weld some thicker plate on the pin to make a like a hammer wrench you could beat on to get the pin to turn? Once you got the pin turning it should come out easier. The heat from welding may help loosen it if it's rusted too. Not sure if the cylinder uses seals on the pin but they could be easily replaced once the cylinder is off. Welding a big nut on the pin is another option. Then you could hit it with a big impact wrench. https://www.grainger.com/product/PROTO-Striking-Wrench-Alloy-Steel-19C634
This is a small clamp I made for pushing stuck pins. I call it "Junior" made from 3/4" X 2" wide strip. A small chain and binder keep the clamp from spreading as you apply pressure. I have "Senior" also and he's just a tad bit larger but don't have a photo. Both work well with a hollow guide for the stuck pin to push into with pressure from the forcing screw, and heat applied to the frozen area(s) of the pin, (usually with a rosebud). The tire is on my manlift and it's 15" wide for reference. I have others you thread a porto power ram into and use hydraulic pressure too but they require a helper to set up.
Bucket Cylinder removal Very soon I am going to have to remove and re-seal the bucket cylinder on my '97 555E. I've read a lot of the posts on cylinder repair and have sourced this seal kit through Reliable Aftermarket Parts. My questions/concerns are: 1. How much does this darn thing weigh? (I assume I am going to... HeavyEquipmentForums This thread just went over the basics of DIY on the machine seal replacement. It'll give you an idea of what's involved and how to go about it. It ain't rocket science Joe H
Title to the thread is: Removing hydraulic cylinder for repair
I'm unable to access one side of the pin.
Time to get the gas axe out then and get the bracket good and hot.
Gee, that's a pretty poor idea from Cat. Can you fill most of the inside gap between the cylinder lug and the frame with sealant, and then fill the area with penetrant? It looks like you're going to need a hydraulic pin puller. Maybe you can hire one locally? Or maybe you have the skills and equipment (or good buddies with equipment!) to fabricate a pulling arrangement? For a start, you'll need a hollow press cylinder, probably around 30 tons. Then you'll need a length of large diameter threaded rod and nuts - plus a fabricated tool that can lock into that groove on the pin head. These guys are using a commercial pin pulling tool to extract a 5th wheel pivot pin. They welded a nut (it's actually a Tiger tool weld-on pulling adaptor) on the head of the pin. Maybe the same setup will work for you. The heat from welding will assist in freeing up the pin, and the welded nut is easily cut off after the pin has been removed.
You won't need to reach the inside , so long as there is enough room for the pin to be removed from the inside there is no problem . Lack of wear showing in the picture points to the pin being held by the lugs . That pin is a tiddler and will fair pop out once the lugs are heated . Don't heat the pin directly as thats needed solid so not to mushroom . While you are at it with all the tools consider doing the other rams . Lesson I had to learn when second lift ram seal failed 20 hours later . You are lucky you can manhandle the rams . Another issue I'm not too sure its a good idea to clean up the holes in the lugs before re- assembly , having pins chew out the lugs and replacing lugs is harder than driving a pin out
Tiger tool has some nice stuff
Just leave it pull out the chrome rod put a kit in her .I have one on backhoe came apart piston stuck at bottom how do ya get that out ?
Disconnect the hydraulic line that feeds oil to the back side of the piston. Apply compressed air @ 120psi into that port and make sure you are standing well back....!!
I typically use a shop hydraulic pump and pump oil into a cylinder pushing the piston out. Once free, drain and recapture the oil or bill it out as shop expense. If you are able to tilt the cylinder down use water as it will run out and dry before any rust starts.
Put something like a pile of rags at the end so the piston doesn't go flying too far out the end.
If the rod is out of the piston pumping oil or air won't help much as it will just go through the rod hole . You don't want the piston falling out of it , replace the cap less the rod , suspend the ram vertically using a pulley and rope , lower ram quickly to the floor striking the end of the ram against some solid wood . Remove your cap and with a large bolt poked in the rod hole catching through it ease it out the last bit .
Could maybe take something like an O/A welding rod or a long piece of small round stock and bend a short 90 deg. on the end to fit in the hole where the rod is normally attached. Another thought is using a wooden dowel or something and putting a piece of rubber or foam on the end to push against the piston while also applying air in the cylinder port to carefully push the piston out. It shouldn't take too much pressure just to move the piston.
Times like this, or should I say posts like this causes me to ask myself why any manufacturer would purposely eliminate a few minutes of machining and a 15 cent grease fitting. They even makes grease guns today that don't require you to physically work the pump.
You have to engineer parts sales in the designs LOL
Long ago & far away I asked a teacher at a automatic transmission class why they didn't put drain plugs in the torque convertor. He said that it would cost $0.10 to do so, so they didn't. Those were 1976 dollars. Joe H
Nothing ever goes wrong so why go to the trouble to install grease fittings and drain plugs.
On the upside - if you don't have a drain plug in the bottom of a housing, it can't fall out from vibration or from forgetting to tighten it! Back in the bad ol' days when many vehicles had rear axle drain plugs in the bottom of the axle housing, it wasn't unusual for them to fall out on rough roads (corrugations/washboard), resulting in a full lubricant drain, followed shortly by a whining differential as it protested about the lack of lubricant! My truckie neighbour ran a Cummins-powered KW running East-West, and is known to be a bit of a "rip, tear and bust" individual, with an accent on speed, rather than on accuracy and thoroughness! He told me how one time, he did a rapid engine oil/filter change on the KW - his employee driver rolled up to do a trip to the East, and off he went. Shortly afterwards, the truckie started having those horrible thoughts about whether he'd properly tightened the engine oil pan plug. He managed to send through a message to one of the roadhouses along the way to get the employee driver to call him. The driver got the message and called him, and he said to him, "Get underneath the engine, and make double sure I tightened that drain plug properly!" The employee came back to him and said, "Yep, I checked it and it's tight! - all good!" The next day, the driver called in and said, "You know that engine oil drain plug? I checked the one on the bottom of the oil pan, and didn't check the one on the side of the oil pan! It fell out and the engine is toast!!"
My F150 doesn't have a dipstick for the transmission. A few years ago a salesmen where I worked got a new F150 and when he discovered it didn't have a dipstick for the trans. traded it for a GM. Nothing wrong with the truck otherwise but I think he figured he was going to have trans. problems if he couldn't check the level. I've never had a trans. problem on any vehicle and don't many who have either.