As an amateur operator (under 700 hours) I am cutting fire breaks and walking trails in very hilly (even steep) terrain. I don't tackle trees above 12 inches, make sure to cut deep enough on 30 degree + slopes to keep both tracks on virgin soil, and constantly assess my position relative to the hillside, vegetation and path forward. As the saying goes in aircraft pilot training: "There are old pilots and bold pilots but no old, bold pilots." I would really appreciate the sharing of wisdom and insights from those highly experienced operators: What have you learned that keeps you safe? What mistakes have you made and how did you prevent them in the future? What advice do you have to keep me from winning a Darwin award. I get that operating an excavator can kill you quickly if your skill set isn't up to the application. As a note, I have watched about 25 hours of online CAT excavator training and read several books on cutting techniques. Thanks a bunch. Allan
Steep is relative to the environment you grew up in. Example, Fllatlanders think stairs are steep, so it all comes down to your comfort zone. Pushing that zone out a little gains experience but pushing inexperience to far and fast becomes a disaster. Watching training videos and reading manuals doesn't account for much IMO but the feeling in your ass tells you everything . I didn't have anyone to teach me how to work steep country and I have had some close calls and each one taught me real good.
Wet grass and moss are slippery. I watched a guy with a 400 Hitachi with a welder in the bucket (machine, not the man) walk over a side hill that was wet grass and moss. As soon as the tracks were on the down hill slope, she was just like a sled in winter. He didn't want to drop the welder, and heel of the bucket wouldn't stop him. Only time that machine ever went that fast was on the back of a float. Videos can give you a few basics, but like Tones said, your own ass is the best teacher.. You can get the feel for her. I learned how to operate a hoe in a quarry in winter. Nothin keeps you on your toes like steel tracks on rock and ice. I'm not much for seatbelts, but a few mishaps in the quarry that took me out of the seat, and I started using it there.. Tracks up and down the hill, never side on. Keep your bucket low, depending on how steep you are sitting, make smooth movements, nothing like that feeling of swinging around with a hard wood stump in your thumb, and stopping a little quick and having that feeling of your ass end coming of the ground.
I agree with cutting edge. Keep your tracks up and down with the hill. Drives on the low side and wear your damned seat belt! You can leave the door open incase you decide to bail....chances are you are gonna die anyways when the machine squishes you. But seriously, wear your seat belt. The only time that I almost fell out of a machine was while running an excavator. A face plant against the front glass was the only thing that kept me from eating the ground.
I broke a windshield with my feet for not wearing a seat belt on some sketchy slopes You can climb dang near vertical if you pull yourself up especially with a zero tail swing machine but if the ground walks out from under you you are not in control more there for the ride and when you Crest over a slope to go down dont hesitate or gravity will take over I learned rocks are slick wet or dry on steel tracks they make a great base to put under your tracks until everything shifts and then gravity takes over Moral to my opinions if you have doubts or your seat gets swallowed by your rear slow down build a better road
As mentioned above, things get slick when the grousers are crossways. They act like ice skates on side hills. I got bit once by the seatbelt thing with a mini, I jammed my thumb on the cage when I set myself down from really high up. Seatbelt is the way to go. Sounds to me that you are approaching things from the right angle. The virgin ground thing though, that is not always practical. If you key your fill material into the slope on the downhill side you are safe. you can't just spill it down there and hope it doesn't slide out from under you, but you can run safely on fill that you place properly. Here is an example of running on your own fill. I am trenching in fiber optics for the railroad, and every bit of dirt I take out goes under my downhill track. I had to dig a 4' deep trench and use no shoring, so the wall had to be vertical. It also had to be as close to the fence as we could place it, without harming the fence. I did not need to key in my fill but if I did, I would make a notch down there and beat the soil in as I built it up.
That's the great thing about these zero swing machines, is being able to work tight quarters. I don't operate a hoe much any more. I learned to operate on 400s and 350s. Most of the seat time I get now is on zero swing machines. A lot of rubber track machines. The guys make fun because I am always looking back to make sure I am not going to rub the counter weight on something. Just as soon as I stop doing that, I'll be in a 350 and tear the side of a truck.
Had to repaint a counter weight for that reason
Skyking1: I haven't been keying the downhill side. On really steep stuff I go slow but sometimes I feel the downhill track settle too much (especially with dry, sandy soil)--which gives me that pucker feeling. I will start keying the downhill side. Makes a lot of sense. I appreciate all those that have shared their knowledge and experience on this thread. BTW, a neighbor that has a firewood business always used his Bobcat forklift (like a skidsteer) without seatbelts. Last time I saw him he was limping badly. He said he picked up a heavy pallet that raised the cab back wheels off of the ground. When he tried to correct with controls the pallet slid toward the cab while he fell forward (no seat belt). Both of his legs were pinned between the pallet and the cab. Ouch. Since then I've always worn that seat belt!
Most of the benching I have done was for pipeline work and I'd leave the fill higher than the natural ground. Many of those jobs were dig and lay so I had to carry the pipes along the bench which did drop a little. Using the trench spoil I'd level up the digger so the walls were vertical. Never thought of benching the fill though. After the pipes were in everything was reinstated .
It is remarkable the slopes a excavator can go up/down. I am not certainly not recommending what is shown in the photo but it can be done.
From your picture it looks like you have a mini. I like to keep the blade down hill. When its wet that will bite in way better then the tracks.
if I'm cutting a trail I assume it is there to stay. I treat the fill just like you would with a dozer, lifts and track it in or roll it. Allan M, if it is really flour dirt with no moisture then that method doesn't work. Be extra careful with that stuff. I had a 1/2 to 1 *slope* we were cutting on Highway 12, and all I had was that flour. It was going OK then they moved the stakes and clearing limits uphill out of my reach. That flour dirt would not stand up below me for nothing.
I appreciate all of the input. Definitely helping my learning curve. Here are two pics of my project: Cutting upslope at about 10 to 15 degrees with a cross slope varying from 20 to 45 degrees. As I turned the corner (in upslope pic) I got into flour dirt as skyking1 mentioned. I didn't know what to call it. Spooky stuff. The down slope shot shows my progress. I'm working through manzanita, oak, toyon, coyote bush, bay and poison oak. Many parts of this terrain are too steep to walk--or not passable without a chainsaw and machete. So, I'm making a walking/ATV trail about 8' wide with a slight downslope (since no culverts)--hoping that rain ruts won't become an issue. I have about 1/4 mile complete so far. Goal is about 2 miles. I'm working through areas that I think no human has been before--so a pioneering feeling.
You are doing good for a learner. Just one mistake I see, the track should be tipped towards the uphill bank. Water running off outside bank will tear your work in no time
Skyking why didn't they directional drill those fiber conduits? Just curious.
15 miles, digging alongside and through the main north-south fiber data trunks from central western Oregon to Seattle and beyond.
exactly this, and if you have a concern about water running down your trail, put in some thank you maam's using some of the brush and logs you remove. That's a bump that is designed to divert water periodically from a downsloping road. Use stumps and whatnot to hold things together at the downhill edge, a sort of log waterfall. Pick spots that are at the natural drainage lines of the land. If you have funds for a pipe, put a pipe in at that spot and pitch the slope to that pipe as Tones mentioned. The big caveat there is a pipe means maintenance. you need to keep it clear or install brush screens.