After Mitch and the others made fun of me for using a 8 axle to haul a d6r I thought it was time to buy a spare lowboy and truck lol, The problem is that this ole B model air to air 425 is just a little sluggish, so I got to thinking, how about dropping in a 3408 (arrangement 4n6724) out of a 631 scraper ? Has anyone ever personally done it or know someone that has ? The truck I want to do it to is a 379 shorthood, has a 1700lb 15spd and 44k rears with a 12k frt and 25k pusher, I can use this truck on any of my lowboys but this one that I bought with it is a '03 eager beaver 55ton and on a side note it is built heavier than my 55ton talberts. This truck will work great in commercial and for medium hauler in non comm zones it doesn't have the wheelbase I need in order to gross 160 in non comm but that's beside the point. My questions are, will the motor even fit ? I know ppl that have done it to 359's with "a foot in the hood" but that's a totally different animal. What serial or arrangement numbers should I look for for a 3408 to make my life easier ? I have looked at weight and it looks like the 3408 only weighs a addtl 1000lb but I can't find any other torque or horsepower specs, what am I going to have to do to tie it up to my 15spd
Sorry... An 08 in a short hood just isn't gonna happen. Besides, your 06 can be made to run for a fraction of the price.
Friend of mine has two 359's with 3408 pc engines, they run good , sound great and roll lots of coal. no jake brake. And no room under hood. I would tune up the 3406. Much cheaper to operate.
Sorry to hear it won't fit I also have an long hood 379 but it has a good E model......a lot of work but I could move the E to the shorthood and then 08 the exhd..... Eh second thought screw that, let's just throw the fuel screws in the glove box on the B and slap a 08 turbo on ' er and run till she pops then go get another truck ! ? Lol..... On a side note was all will a 12volt starter even turn a big ole 3408 over ? BTW WOOHOOO 800 post too bad most of them are not worth reading haha
glad to hear your going to give the 3406 a tune. Rolling at 160k w/o a jake wouldn't be any fun. I imagine a set of injectors, maybe a turbo and a fuel adjustment and your 3406 should be hitting 650 easy.
Additionally your 3408 is a museum piece from a 1980's 631D. A PC Chamber engine that only produces 467BHP @ 2200RPM with 1380ft.lb. of torque @ 1500RPM. A 3046 can be set up to better both those numbers (and maybe get the max torque to come in a bit further down the rev range) for much less than what you had planned. Post the arrangement number of your 3406B and I'll see what on-highway arrangements are available to turn the wick up on it a hair, plus maybe a Jake if you're interested.
Pj.
Dumb question: is a 3408 a V8, or straight 8?
V8. Now slap yourself in the forehead.
Well, I was 90% sure of that, but they were talking about needing more hood length, so I wondered if I was slipping.
Well I understand wy Mitch is confused (other than it being after 5 on a Friday :drinkup lol ). ...... I am not sure how V8 would fit on s exded hood but not a short hood.......? Pj
I meant the V8 Juice drink slap, as in "I could've had a V8." Same engine, just 2 more cylinders than a 3406 and in a V8.
Yeah, I knew it was the 34 family, but most V8s in the same family are shorter than straight 6s in the same family. I hadn't thought of the V8 drink. And actually I hadn't thought of the :drinkup drink either. A good customer's loader lost it's steering yesterday, and he needed it bad, so we had the parts sent overnight air. Turns out, Since it is a small town, the 10 am guarantee doesn't apply. The parts got here at 5:30, and I just got it together about 9 pm.
Love it. Pretty bad when you are the only one up in the house and are truly LOLing.
Engine Serial Number is in fact better ......... 4MG21229 is listed as 9Y-2447 Arrangement. 425BHP @ 2100RPM, CARB-certified, Peterbilt. Torque 1420ft.lb @ 1200RPM. So your 3408 would have had less torque and 300RPM higher up the rev range to boot. Not good. Now more bad news. There is no standard arrangement for a 4MG-prefix 3406B on-highway engine that produces more than 425BHP. I think what kills it is the 2100RPM rev limit. I did find various (but non-CARB certified) arrangements of a 2EK-prefix 3406B and multiple options for 3406C engines for Peterbilt fitment that produce 460BHP @ 1900RPM with a whopping 1615ft.lb of torque @ 1200RPM, the same RPM as your engine. A couple of them even had Jake Brake installations as standard. On those engines the block, head, & camshaft are the same as yours, the crankshaft, rods/pistons are different, as are obviously things like the turbo & injectors. Could get messy ............ The other option would be a 3406E. Plenty of 500BHP+ arrangements @ 1800RPM which seems to be the max RPM for a 3406E built for Peterbilt installation with/without Jake Brakes that produce over 1800ft.lbs. of torque @ 1200RPM. Remember all the above are standard arrangements, you could quite likely mix and match other parts with your existing engine to get what you want but you'd end up with a b*****d step-child. Quite honestly the reduction in max RPM from 2100 to 1800/1900 but with a whopping increase in torque would be the way to go but it's going to cost you a whole different engine. An anecdote at this point while we are discussing torque ...... It's a subject that carries a bit of mystique, it seems. Ask an average person in our line of work to define exactly what it is - and its relationship to horsepower - and often the room falls suddenly silent. Well one very famous (and sadly now departed) UK motorcycling journalist explained the relationship like this.... Sometimes the mark of a true genius is his (or her) ability to explain a tricky subject in a way we can all understand. The late John Robinson - he of PB Magazine fame - was, in my humble opinion, a genius. Here's how he defined the difference between torque and horsepower; "Suppose some miscreant were to chuck a 20 pound labrador off a cliff - only a puppy, really. You scramble down the cliff, discover the animal is fine, affix a rope to its collar then cast about for ways and means of raising it to the top of the cliff. Any engine making 20 ft/lb of torque, and attached to a 1ft radius winch, would be able to lift the labrador. An engine which gave this torque at 4,000rpm would be able to lift the dog twice as fast as one that did the business at 2,000rpm. And that's the difference between torque and horsepower. "Torque is what you require to get the labrador back up the cliff, horsepower is how fast you get it back."
Nige, I haven't seen PB for almost twenty years, but Robinson and the whole magazine were just brilliant. Head and shoulders above the rest. As to an engine for this truck, you might think about an ISX. They're a bit overly complicated, but they have a massively strong jake brake.
Performance Bikes, aka "Performing Berks". I was weaned on that magazine. John Robinson of course wrote for many motorcycle magazines & even weeklies like MCN. He was the one who, when BMW introduced their first ABS braking system on a bike stated loudly to all within earshot that he could stop the bike quicker without ABS than with it. "Nein, nein" quoth the German engineers, "Zis ees not possible". To which Robinson took a bike out and proved it to them, stopping it measureably quicker without ABS than with. Apparently the Germans retreated rapidly to Munich in disarray and the ABS system was not seen again in public for at least another couple of years by which time it was at about a Mk. 10 version. Robinson was vindicated .......
Strange you say that because I had my KW dealer call the other day offering me a t800W with a brake saver, I'm supposed to go look at it sometime when I get a chance has anyone been around the "brake saver"? The truck is set up a little strange it has a c16 with 18+4 but it only has a 12k frt and a 12k pusher with 36k rears all setting on a single frame. I'm not sure if it'll hold up all that good for me ?.
Nige I appreciate the input as always but would engine serial number 48w2149 make any difference ?
Are you sure that engine number is correct..? There should be 5 digits after the 48W, not 4.
P j
Now I'm standing on my head trying to read the numbers ..... Another museum piece. PC engine dating back to happier times. 467BHP @ 2000RPM with 1380ft.lbs. of torque at 1500RPM. Too high - you need an engine to produce its max torque @ 1200RPM like your existing engine.
Lol just turn your monitor over like I did..... Ok, well looks like we'll just scrap the idea of re powering the truck, the pans are worth more running and complete anyways
If you went for a later mechanical injection 3408 DI TA JWAC engine from a 631D (applicable from S/N 48W44485-Up) they can be set to produce 490BHP @ 2000RPM and 1560ft.lbs. of torque @ 1600RPM. More BHP & torque but still at RPM numbers that probably don't match with the transmission & FD ratios of your truck.
What's your thoughts on a KTA19 ?
Worked with them a long time ago but no recent experience. Seemed pretty good back then. Talking about repowers and off on a totally different tack we're just in the process of replacing the Powerjoke (oops, sorry - Powerstroke) in one of our Ford F550's with a Cummins. Sits well in that hole doesn't it, just like it should have been there from the start ...... and the best thing is there are NO electronics on it whatsoever.
Thanks for the memories Nige. A truly excellent publication. I remember laughing so hard at the writings of Robinson, Simon Hargraves (SP?) and Roop. When I was 17, my helmet had a PB supplied sticker on the front which said "Put your hands up and empty the till" Anyway, don't want to derail. Back to the thread.....
I've had limited experience with one but there's a guy about 40 miles west of St. Joe that has one in a cabover. He's got the coal poured to it and he blows a head gasket about everytime he gets in a good race. But, its turned up to who knows where, he's been through it multiple times and drives it like he likes to work on it. Lol. 6 seperate heads I believe. Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
Nige that looks like a pretty modern F-550. No luck with the 6.7? Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
Clean looking job, what do you plan on doing for gauges ?
A small "electrical" box comes with the conversion. All the pressure/temp/whatever sensors hook into that and it in turn hooks up to the Ford wiring harness.
I read something on the kenworth break saver a while back. From what I understand it works the same way a trans brake does on the Volvo arctics.
This was a cat thing, not sure if kW is the only one that uses it or not...... Almost like a torque converter setup or something, I read up on it but forgot what it was now Pj
Hello fellers, just trolling this site ,waiting for something to tear up here in the ''BAKKEN'' to jump in on your conversation , we called the 3408 in a truck the ''double breasted home wrecker'' kinda like a fat gal that wont stay home ,built to run but always causing problems. any of ya'll ever delt with Diesel Injection of Pittsburgh ,they can probably help you put some pep in your B-models step , there was an old guy I knew back home in Ms. who could make a 3406 ''knock fire'' ,but he passed on a couple weeks ago ** R.I.P. TALL-BOY** as far as a KT-Cummins , they will dang near ''out run the word of God'' Diesel Injection can help you with that too if you've got the green. I have heard of 1000+H.P. to the wheel. I am in the process of putting a Johnson and Towers built 8v92tta 720hp in my 76 w900a, but it will only be a toy as yacht engine are not built for continuous duty, but I can run it long enough to **** some guy off in a $120K Pete hahaha