Anybody ever rebuild one of these valve bodies? The vickers dump valve has blown the big o-ring that seals to the valve body. First local hydraulic shop gave me 2 different o-rings and neither was correct. Machine leaked with first one I put in, swapped it for 2nd and it no longer leaked. Then while trimming a fence row last week, it started gushing oil out every time anything was cycled. Parked machine, went on vacation. Back to repairs today. A different hydraulic shop said its a #16 fitting. Handed me an o-ring and sent me out the door. I'm putting it back together and taking it out to the machine, but is there anything else I should be looking into before I put it back. Machine cycles, functions as it should so I don't believe anything else is mis-behaving. I just have a lot of work lined up for this machine this month and I am getting really tired of the down time. I already had to rent a towable last month due to a broken final drive, not looking to keep renting.
You just need the right oring is all. In your last pic from the side view, that one looks a bit thick. On average the outer part of the oring will be slightly bigger than the outer thread diameter.
When you say you went to a hydraulic shop you mean you went to like a hose shop for valve block parts?
All of the fittings/valves in that manifold are SAE o-ring boss where they screw into the manifold. SAE o-ring boss requires 900 series o-rings, any other series, 100, 200, 300 series, etc, will fail, you have to use 900 series o-rings. If it's a SAE -16 (dash 16) size, the o-ring would be 568-916. If a fitting is a SAE -8 size, the o-ring would be 568-908. You have to use 900 series o-rings. If that's your machine and you plan on keeping it I'd suggest obtaining an o-ring boss o-ring kit, you're going to need it as time goes by. As for the narrow cross section o-rings on the cartridge valves in that manifold, you'll find them in the US Industrial o-ring kit as those o-rings are the ought series, like 568-011.
Solid info guys. I went a hydraulics shop that repairs motors, pumps, etc. They sent me out with what he called a number 16 size o-ring. Later, I went through my parts manual for the machine and found that JLG has a seal kit for the dump cartridge that has the 2 viton o-rings and the plastic backing ring. I was able to get one ordered and its on the way already.
Should see if you have a dedicated seal supplier nearby.
@willie59 Does the durometer or material they're made from matter? I quick searched Amazon and found several boss o-ring kits (900 series) with different durometer listed, and different materials listed. The parts and service manuals I have do not list anything for those specs and just list seal kits for the various valves and cartridges. That said, the kits are not readily available for this 27 year old machine, and they aren't cheap either. It cost me $32 after shipping for 2 o-rings and the plastic backing ring. For $40, I can buy a 275 piece boss o-ring kit. So, one off here and there, the seal kits work, but if I have to do a lot of them, it doesn't make much sense. As they aren't horribly expensive, I would like to pick up a couple different kits to cover my basic needs. Aside from a boss o-ring kit for the JLG for the valve bodies, what other kits should I pick up? I'm covering 3 different machines: the JLG lift, a bobcat 753, and an old Deere 310A. I had no idea there were so many different types of o-rings until a few minutes ago.
I bet you’re sorry you asked now aren’t you.?
No, I appreciate the knowledge. I think it'll save me a lot of headaches in the long run servicing my old equipment.
900 series o-rings are typically 90 duro. However, they are also available in 70 duro. I've used both and haven't ran across an application of either that produce a noticeable difference that would sway me one way or another. For the machines you have, the Boss o-ring kit and the US Industrial kit will supply you with most of the o-rings that you need, except for large o-rings like lids for hydraulic return filters or suction flanges, stuff like that, but those two kits will take care of the bulk of fittings and valves you'll be dealing with. And yes, cartridge valves typically use the ought size o-rings and typically have a back up ring, either a split ring teflon or one piece urethane. I had my local seal supplier put together a kit for me of one piece urethane back up rings for my ought size o-rings like the 568-011, 568-014 etc. In most cases you can re-use your old back up rings on those valves, but sometimes pressure erosion from a faulty o-ring will distort them and it's best to replace them.
Thank you for sharing Willie59, I appreciate the information.
What was the condition of the o rings that were leaking? Did they appear to be eroded? That appears to be an aluminum block and I have found many to be cracked in the bevel seat for the o ring esp. if the o ring is eroded.
O-ring was blown out and separated. I still have it, I'll take a pic to share. I did look at the valve block but did not see any wear or erosion where the o-ring goes.
Something that's pretty common on those manifolds is failure from dissimilar metals, steel cartridge valve, aluminum manifold, those two metals expand and contract at different amounts and causes the steel cartridge valve to get just the slightest bit loose. Add that to an aged o-ring which has become hard from heat over time and lost its elasticity and boom, pressure will find a gap and cause rapid erosion failure of the o-ring. When I find one that has done that I replace all the o-rings on that particular manifold. I just recently did that on a Genie GTH-1056, all the o-rings on the main control valve as well as the solenoid valve manifolds, a bunch of damn o-rings. But it had become a leaky beast and prone to sudden o-ring failure on a job site, it was time remedy that problem.
And we haven't even brought up BSPP or German DIN.
Colson, not really sure about that Deere 310A, that's an older machine and I can't recall for sure, but Deere is fond of hose fittings that are o-ring face seal (ORFS). If that's the case on your machine you might want to score an ORFS o-ring kit. The JLG and Bobcat are pretty much JIC fittings, those fittings don't require an o-ring where the hose connects to a fitting. The only exception to that general rule is sometimes Bobcat used Parker JIC Triple-Lok fittings on some of the high pressure fittings, like drive hose fittings. It's the same fitting as a JIC but has an added o-ring on the fitting. Don't worry much about them. Just my personal opinion from experience, I just don't see the added benefit of adding an o-ring to a JIC fitting. If a JIC is fitted proper it's a fairly reliable seal, no need for a second redundant seal. I'm sure there's an application where the Triple-Lok is beneficial, just don't see, rather, have never seen it being a problem on a Bobcat. JMHO
We usually have 90 ORB, ORFS, a general parker like 200 series kit for low pressure stuff, flange kit and a cat flange kit. Covers the majority of oh no's in the field.
If the block is cracked it may be difficult to see. It will not look like a scratch, it will have a zig zag pattern. A magnifing glass helps .
Guess what?! Life just keeps getting better. @Vetech63 I absolutely loathe parts guys right now. I have the parts manual for this machine. Found JLG has a seal kit for this dump cartridge (p/n 7010560). Local JLG dealer said price is cheaper if I order that seal kit direct off JLG's website. $31 after shipping and they have 1 in stock in Georgia. I received package, removed valve block from machine, opened UPS package and found this: Package clearly states correct part number and and item description, but the only thing in the bag is a M'F'in sticker!!!!
Hahaha
LMAO!
You could use some Teflon tape on the threads with the oring and call it a day.
Yep, you got a cracked manifold. I hate it when that happens
Make sure you use that real cheap stuff from home creapo.
I my experience when the CORRECT o'ring is blown there is often an under lying issue. It is common for hose flange ends to be cracked in high pressure applications (6000 psi) .
Update: I have 2 hydraulic shops near me. A father owns one that only works on big hydraulic stuff, the son owns an equally sized shop that only works on small hydraulic stuff. Both shops are large, an employ lots of people. Big shop says my valve body is too small, go see the other shop, 5 miles away. I go see the owner himself of the little shop. He examines it and says basically my part is scrap and that there is a machine shop in Marne, MI that specializes in building one off replacement valve bodies and hydraulic manifolds, but it isn't cheap. I talked to a close friend who's dad owns a modern machine shop. My buddy and his dad looked it over and sent me to a fabrication shop nearby to have it ground out and welded up. I got the welded part back yesterday and dropped it off to my buddy at their shop. They actually have the cartridge tooling for machining manifold and are going to try and salvage my part.
Not to throw shade as I wish you luck in repairing your block, but that crack extends all the way to the pressure port, not just what you see. Have you searched for a used block, do you have the part number of the block?
The machine shop that did the welding chased the crack with a mill until it stopped in an adjoining port. Is this a surefire fix? I don't know. We'll see if it turns out. The part was scrap before, and if it stays scrap, that's a bummer, but I'm no farther behind for trying it. As for a used part, yes, I called many equipment dismantlers across the country and nobody has one. JLG's p/n is 4640716. A search on machinery trader shows 3 dealers with 4 parts in stock. A call to all 3 dealers showed nobody actually has that part anymore and Machinery Trader's advertised inventory is incorrect. That said, this part was installed on 9 different models over a 8 or so year period in the early 90s, so if you have a lead, by all means send it to me. I'm losing money by not having this machine running right now.
Haaaahhhhhhh!. I'd be peeved if that was me, but its not me- so its hilarious. Sorry your having trouble getting it fixed. Call the rental house until you get yours up? Edit: I saw you've been renting. The joys of old cheap equipment, means you can afford to have 2 pieces of old equipment, so you have either a parts machine, or one you run when the "good" one is down.....
I have to laugh about your last comment. I saw another JLG for sale fairly local, 40H instead of a 45HA. Slightly smaller machine, straight boom, but was priced under $5000. Machine was complete and operable, but had a bad leak from the boom. I considered it, talked to seller and discussed it with my wife and then decided I didn't need a project machine right now. Fast forward 6 weeks, that machine would have had the part I need today as they share the same accessory valve body. I could have swapped valve blocks and been right back to work.
Long over due update: Lift is still broke down for the same part. Part was welded, machined, and installed back in July. I ran it for about 10 minutes in my yard and then had a geyser of fluid coming out. @partsandservice was spot on. It cracked right through the weld. So, valve block went to a machine shop in August to have a new manifold block made. I went there this morning and retrieved my parts, still sitting in the bucket I dropped them off in. That shop is slammed with work and can't hire enough guys to keep up with the workload for their big contracts, let along side projects. So, I picked it up, and headed to a hydraulics specialty shop a ways away. They specialize in manifolds, custom cylinders, etc so this is their thing. They said they would have me a quote by next week, and if agreed, could have me a new block in 3-6 months. At this point, I've been renting a lift as needed, climbing when it makes sense, or turning down some projects that didn't make financial sense. I'm looking to get this lift operational so I can trade it off on a 65ft bucket truck.
I see bucket trucks around here pretty cheap. I'm west of Peoria, IL about 25 miles. You purchase a running something, I'll go get it and have room to store; no problem.
I always used ductile iron manifolds usually made by Daman in Mishawaka IN. The expansion/contraction rates of steel vs aluminum due to heat /cold cycles will always create issues.
I just got off the phone with BMH Hydraulics. They quoted me about $1100 to make me a new manifold out of ductile iron with an estimated delivery in 6 weeks. I said get it done. So, if all goes well, I should have my lift operational by April.
BMH came through big for me and completed their end of the project mid March. I picked up the part, but it sat on my bench for about 3 weeks until a nice day came along to install it. New block is made of ductile iron, cracked block is on right. These guys even took the time to replace all o-rings, and clock the fittings. Install was plug and play, not fighting hoses, etc. Lift is on its first job in 9 months because of thos block. Glad to have it back.
That block will probably be the last thing left in operable condition when the lift finally goes to the knacker’s yard. Keep it and sell it on Machinery Trader if that happens.
He needs to list the valve for sale on ebay at a 200 % markup and keep having his machine shop make them as needed. He could become the parts king of Michigan.
I dunno about becoming some parts king. I think most guys would have scrapped the machine or parted it out before they dropped coin for a new valve body on this old of a machine. I paid $5000 for the lift. So far, I've replaced 3 of the controls for $480, a final drive for $900, this valve body for $1100, a thermostat for $10, and some PM work. Counting my labor, I've doubled the purchase price on this machine in repairs. Now, I've got a quote from a tire guy for $2000ish for 4 new tires (8.75x16.5, foam filled). The tires are in very rough shape, but keep going around for now. I'd like a wider tire (9.5x16.5 was a factory option), but they aren't any cheaper.
I have a dozer like that ...
You may have dropped some coin in it, but at least you know what you have and what kind of shape it's in compared to purchasing either a new machine or another used one, that broad as it is long question, but again, at least you know what you now have. In my experience, age and hours on a machine mean less than the condition it's in. We have two old Gehl DL-10H telehandlers, one with over 10K hours, that I maintain and keep in service because the boss won't pull the trigger to replace them. And that's what sucks for me, I hate DL Gehl machines, didn't like them when they were new, from a mechanics point of view that is. But here I am keeping two of them going and the damn dinosaurs refuse to die! And therein is the rub, as much as I hate them, for me, as the employed wrench bender, like the line from the John Wayne movie The Train Robbers..."something to do".
I agree @willie59 . Its frustrating some days, but has penciled out so far. A similar lift for my current job would have been $1500 for a week, plus delivery. She ain't the newest machine, but she earns her keep.