I'm considering buying a used piece of equipment for use around the homestead. First a little background. We already have a Loader/backhoe, but it's in need of some TLC. It's a 1969 Allis Chalmers ~50hp like an I600. Also have several older tractors that haven't run in years... but would with a new battery, gas, and points. Everything ran when it was parked; just haven't had a need to use them. BTW, all other equipment is smaller than the loader; IH Cub, Ford 3000, Ford 600 etc. The property needs some TLC too. Mostly over grown nursery stock, (pine trees, azaleas, spruce, etc) about 7 acres. There's snow plowing to do in the winter and general ranch/farm/nursery work all year. Once a year I need to move 10 or so 2,000 pallets which is done now with the AC loader with a set of forks stuck on the front of the bucket. Also there is some clean-up that needs to be done. An old barn has fallen down from snow load and old age. I think an excavator with a hydraulic thumb would be a good choice for clearing the overgrown fields and the old barn, but wouldn't work for the pallets. A skid steer would do the pallet and the fields but not so much for the barn. The loader we already have could do it all, but less efficiently and probably with some flat tires from nails in the barn debris. Budget is small (maybe 10k), mostly because I can't think of any way to make money with anything I buy. The AC loader is paid for. What would you recommend to compliment, or replace the loader? Opinions?
Don't see a way to edit my post... Noticed a type-o It's 10 or so 2000 lb. pallets. Also budget could go to $15k, still not going to get a sizable excavator...
Sounds to me like most everything you have to do can be done with the tractor loader backhoe. You could even take down the barn with it. I would consider renting an excavator to take the barn down. For 15K you should be able to get a decent midsize skid loader that would handle most of the other chores ( it will certainly take the barn down too, I do barn and shed demo occasionally with my skid) Keep in mind that 15K will only get you started, you can easily spend that much in attachments too. Fortunately, you can rent about any attachment that you can think of so you don't have to throw money at attachments that you will only use occasionally. If you have any significant amount of snow removal work to do, consider getting a skid with an enclosed cab and heater. While you can mow with the skid, they are not very good at it (in my opinion) unless you are using it for heavy brush. In that instance, they really shine. They just don't manicure the grass as well as a tractor drawn rotary shredder or finish mower. You said you already have some other tractors, you might take the best of those, fix it up and dedicate it to general mowing chores. I am not knocking your excavator idea at all. I just think that since you already own a backhoe which can be used for occasional digging/trenching, a skid may a more versatile piece of equipment for you. I am looking for the right deal on a 5 ton excavator now to round out my equipment holdings. I think a 5 tonner with a hyd thumb would really expand the kinds of work I can do. I've been looking for a while and haven't run across the right deal yet for me. Just my opinion. Since I have a skid loader and a farm tractor, I am sure that colors my thinking. Hopefully others will chime in and give you some other ideas. Tim
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Thanks for the input. I looked into renting an excavator and around here they're getting ~$1,500/ week for a 5 ton size. I expect it'll take three to four weeks to get the jobs done, so that would be $4,500 to $6,000 gone. At that cost I'd probably be better off buying a unit using it for as long as needed then selling it. Probably be cheaper than renting in the long run. Buying at a good price point would be the trick.
True dat, The buying at a good price point thing is the reason I don't have a excavator yet Tim
Reading just this, I'm telling you to go buy one of Cat's big skid loaders. Obviously, you won't get one for under 10k. I'm talking a 289 series rubber tracked machine. Probably with hydraulic high-flow ($15,000 option on a new one). How tall is the barn? The skid can theoretically get it piled up, granted it isnt a 30' tall structure. Are you going to just burn it and bury it? Not as well as you think. If I'm understanding you correctly you have some acres to cover, most of it being short brush-like trees. Situation like that calls for a wider bucket and something a little more mobile than a excavator. If you can get away with taking the barn out with what you have, I would focus your funding towards a machine that will make it easy to do everything else, the pallets, the trees, the light grading, and general miscellaneous farm work. As a dirt contractor that has been in business for 50 years, do not waste your time looking at any kind of an excavator that someone will take less than $10k for. We have a customer that did it, and it conveniently can't even dig itself a hole big enough to drive in and bury itself, which is exactly what it needs. He continues to hire us, get a good job done, and the piece of *#%@ he dropped 15k (after repairs) on sits in the yard completely worthless. If you can get by doing the demo work on the barn with the Allis, do it. Don't go after an excavator because of that one job, it will not be worth it in the end. If you have to hire someone to knock the thing down and pile it up so you can burn it, it won't be that bad of a deal. You will be money ahead having avoided repairing your $10k excavator that will not have gained any value whatsoever. I highly recommend upping your budget to where you can get yourself a bigger skid loader with rubber tracks that can mount a tree shear or a shredder, and obviously your pallet jobs. You will find uses for this type of machine around the place that you never previously thought of, and you will be wondering how you ever operated without it. That being said, these are not cheap machines. Not to mention, putting a skid steer in the type of environment you are describing isn't what I would call conducive to a long life of the machine. If you buy one, lie through your teeth about never having a tree shear or grinder or anything of the sort on it. It is no different than a concrete breaker. I might be biased, but we just did 9 acres of trees for a guy last week, we dropped the 963 in there and spent a couple days piling things up, dug a hole and made it all disappear. I understand where you are coming from by trying to keep all your money, but between your budget which limits you to (sorry in advance) a piece of crap machine, and having aspirations of demolishing a barn and doing land clearing, something is going to have to give. Either spend more money, or hire it done. The line you are trying to walk is going to end up costing you more one way or another. Hope I'm not coming across ******, but I've seen a lot of guys in the situation you are in and it's frustrating watching them make the wrong decision.
The barn is already down. It's in a pile 70' X 30' X 10'. I did want ti pick through the debris a bit, but there's not much there worth the trouble. I think an excavator is out and I'm looking more a skid steers. I'm reading that tracks are more expensive but can lift more, and are best if you're always in the dirt. I don't have any plans to be on hard surface. The hardest part is choosing buy another piece of equipment or repair the Allis. It's been neglected (not by me) and needs brakes (almost non existent), fuel system (won't run unless half choked), electric (doesn't charge battery), worn pivot pins (bucket rolls over center and has to be put to the ground to bring it back). It did just get a new clutch because it wouldn't move any more. And new rear tires. The back hoe is an ARPS 3-piont hitch type which is small for the loader. The stabilizers won't even come close to lifting the rear of the tractor off the ground. Is there a list somewhere that give the model numbers of the different brands skid steers by working load? It's a pain sorting through which ones can work with over 2,000 lbs.
CTL's are expensive to run -keep in mind a CTL track will run $900-1300 a piece depending on the size. I'm going to be brutally honest here and say you're not going to get much in the way of a CTL for $10-15K. It will more than likely be worn out with big ticket items either needing to be repaired or about to. Why would someone sell a good working CTL for $15K when the new ones are over $60K? Take for instance if it needs tracks, that's $2K more or less and if it needs idlers, rollers or sprockets now your spending 20% of what the machine is worth and you haven't touched the engine, hydraulics or anything else.
So you have an old gas Allis with a heavy loader and a three point hitch backhoe. Sounds like a decent choice for what you want to do with the budget you have. Brakes are optional depending on the terrain. Rebuilding an old carburetor is fun, at least the first couple times A new alternator is cheap. You could probably replace the pins pretty cheap and make a big difference functionally, probably no bushing left. If there's room, tire chains can help out a lot on worn tires. A little more information might help on what you want to do with the overgrown acres. What's the soil like? What size range in trunk diameter are you trying to remove? Do you want to keep it open, till it, pasture?
Perhaps. Here there are hills, snow, and mud. I consider brakes a necessity. Often it's the ONLY way to steer. What I don't know is what's involved in fixing then on the old machine. How many $$$? Truth is, I rather dislike the Allis. It takes three hands to drive it. One on the shuttle clutch, one on the steering wheel, and one on the loader control.
How about sell the old Allis, add the money to your budget and buy a TLB that's a few decades newer. $15-20k will get you a decent backhoe if you shop. If you have been getting by with the Allis you be amazed with what you can accomplish with a machine 30 years newer.
I went and looked at skid steers today... for the first time. I quickly discovered that I like joy-sticks/fly-by-wire, and a cab. I think tracks are out due to the cost and reduced usefulness in snow. I think... (dam* I gotta stop doing that... ) a big skid steer with high flow hydraulics, two speed, a cab with heat and a/c, and wheels instead of tracks + a compact (<30 hp) TLB would be a good pair. Comments? Does anyone else have this combo?
What's the budget again??? I like LTx7's idea about upgrading the backhoe. It's possible within the original budget and will do everything you want (except mowing but you have old tractors for that). Compare a used backhoe to a used skid steer in the same price range and you might agree. Then think about which one you'd prefer to work on...
So your saying that a newer TLB is a better choice than a skid steer? I'm obviously having a problem with--- want versus need. I don't really NEED anything different, I have the time to do the whole job with a pick and shovel, and a saw. It would just really suck. Although, time is all we really have, I suppose. I have to balance my time with my dollars; which are limited. C
I do not think you will be happy in mud with a wheeled skid loader.
Use the 10K to make repairs on existing equipment . Then run it . On the barn ....... Burn in place if possible & hire some local knucklehead with a dozer to deal with it .
I think so but you will find people on both sides of that fence. For a skid to be real versatile you need attachments, now were back to the $$$$$ issue.... In my experience 30hp TLB's are not good at much....
I hate it when people are right and it doesn't mesh with what I want to do. Ordered a carburetor repair kit for the Allis. I guess brakes will be next.
Yeah Neosec , I would get the Backhoe & farm tractors up in shape before trying to purchase another piece of equipment to work on . Got a bush hog for the 3000 Ford ? You might be surprised the cleanup & clearing projects that can be done with a bush hog & rubber tire backhoe . I have a small clearing job up next and plan on taking our Ford 4000 with 6' bush hog and skid loader with backhoe attachment . Mow down vines & briers with tractor & take out the trees with the skid & backhoe . Trees are 6" diameter & under and somewhat scattered about . Is your Allis backhoe tractor similar to a D-17 ?
Yup, have a brush hog. Humble, but works. I will send the tractors in for repairs one at a time I suppose. As well as do what I can with what I have. The Allis is like an I-600. Like this... I've read many stories where people put thousands into old tractors and end up with a that function as well as it ever did, but not as well as more modern equipment and is not worth what they put into it.
Yeah Neosec , That's a decision you have to make for yourself on each tractor . How much you spend on it to get it up in shape ? It's best if you can do all the service work . If you have to send them to a shop or equipment dealer ????........... That's a whole different ballgame . It sounds like you can handle some of the repair work , but not all of it ? We do all our own wrenching & repair on trucks & equipment , plus some for customers . Just looking at 3000 fords , seems like average asking price is around $5,000 . http://www.tractorhouse.com/list/list.aspx?ETID=1&catid=1110&Manu=FORD&Mdltxt=3000&mdlx=exact $5,000 wont go very far if you send an old piece of equipment to a shop for repairs . Just one more thing to consider .
I don't have any specialized tools, or anything over 1/2" square drive (which will do a lot). The Ford 3000 has no brakes, and I mean none, due to leaking oil seals. A smaller Ford 600 doesn't lift the 3-point hitch any higher than about a foot. I'm told that repair requires a special tool of some kind. And it hasn't run in years, but ran when it was parked. All tractors have been parked outside there whole life... so you can imagine the condition.
Brake job on the 3000 isn't to big of a deal . I put brakes in the neighbors 3000 , biggest part was removing the wheel . These dry mechanical brakes are marginal at best . I got it put back together & tried the tractor out on a few hillsides and wasn't happy with it . Would lock the wheels but had to damn near stand on the brake peddle . So back to the shop and pulled it all back apart .................. I had checked & lubed up the mechanical linkage , brakes were adjusted up tight .................... I walked over to the bench and grabbed the electric disk grinder and proceeded to ruff up the smooth surface of the cast brake drum ... I know ....... We are all taught the brake drum surface should be nice & smooth .. Put it all back together and sure enough it helped . Still had to put some good pressure on the peddle to lock the wheel but didn't have to stand on it . This guy has a pretty good video replacing brakes on a 3000 . https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CmQq-dDeeWA If you don't have a service manual get one of those I & T books . http://www.tractorsupply.com/en/store/ford-shop-manual-fo-31 You can also log in to New Holland and get part numbers & diagrams . http://agriculture.newholland.com/us/en/Parts-and-Services/Parts/Partstore/Pages/default.aspx
Old bush hogs
I would dump all those old tractors for whatever you could get for them put on an older diesel skid steer with tires no electronics save up for a set of over the tire steel tracks and get some work done it would be in your budget pretty easy with shopping around there is no way you will ever get the same production out of an old gas loader tractor just buy a tire plug kit when you clean up the barn